I guess I am having a hard time seeing how the merest existence of a Feywild that is a) just as much a harsh desert as Athas is, b) is 99.9% destroyed, and c) only included for use if the DM wants to goes against the core conceits of the setting. Look, the original version of Dark Sun had the planes in it! It's not like having the planes in Dark Sun is any different than the original boxed set. We go to all the same trouble of limiting planar travel, as well--planar travel rituals are restricted, and the Gray acts as a barrier between Athas and the Astral Sea.
Yyup. And I hated the references to the planes there, too. I think they were added for the same reason the setting had the PHB races - the powers that be wanted a connection to other systems. You'll note that the planes did get phased out later on, giving athas its own cosmology of sorts.
I don't like the 99.9% destroyed feywild. If it's so destroyed, why include it at all? Because you need to have a justification for some of the 4eisms. But why include those at all? Because (and this is Rich's own words) you want to satisfy those who "always play Eladrin".
Fair enough. But no, I don't like. But easy to fix - it won't be in my game.
If you guys want to get all up on me for saying I'm a fan in a post, fine. I'll stop saying that. I have simply felt that Rich and I and the other designers have put a lot of time, effort, thought and love into coming up with the 4th Edition version of Dark Sun.
And I'm sorry if I came across as being rude. Trust me, I'm very happy you guys are putting this out - and my players will tell you that I've been singing your praises. 95% of what you are releasing is amazing, from what I've seen - but there are things I don't like. And yes, I'd much rather have a fan working on the system than a guy who does it as his "job".
This being the internet, and us being humans, we tend to pick on the negative, rather than focus on the positives. And I apologize for that.
Not to mention that people keep changing the goalposts; as soon as I point out that Athas wasn't cut off from the planes in the original boxed set, I get told that adherence to the strict version of 2E isn't as important as adhering to what Dark Sun could have been. Then hot on the heels of that post is someone saying that ONLY adherence to the strict details of the 2E version proves that you have confidence in the core conceits of the setting. I know that's two different people arguing the point, but when I respond to one person I get someone else saying, "See, this proves the designers are messing up the setting."
Yup. It's kind of a catch 22. And no matter what you do, people will hate on it.
My question here is this: why did 4e Dark Sun need a feywild? Or planes? Or tieflings? What I was trying to say earlier (and failed at) is this perspective:
1) Designer is a fan of the setting. Presumably, he is a fan of the setting for its strengths. If said designer is playing dark sun instead of planescape, we can assume he's not playing it for the planar quirks, or whatever else.
2) Designer gets assigned to work on the new 4e Dark Sun setting.
3) Designer uses all his public service announcements about the changes being made to the setting, using a "we need to fix this" or "how to implement 4e into this design" and then wonders why some fans fly into nerd rage.
By the way, I'm not saying I wouldn't make changes were I in your shoes. They'd just be different changes, that would be just as likely to alienate and anger some old school fans out there. (I'd tweak magic items, which I think you guys did too. I'd hint at city-states beyond the Tyr Region. I'd change magic around. I'd downplay the psionics. I'd make Templars powered by the Divine Power source. I'd keep random wild talents. And so on).
If some of the details are different, it's only because Dungeons & Dragons itself is different than it was 20 years ago, but at the same time I feel like we've been striving to provide a version of Dark Sun that stays true to all the things that made Dark Sun great.
And I really, REALLY hope you succeed. I'm pretty sure you guys will, though those Athas Desert Tiles make me nervous, what with all the water.
Go nuts with the feywild, Eladrin, Tieflings, and all that stuff. I'll throw them right back out. But when you do introduce stuff I like (Dragonborn, for example, seem really cool) I'll keep them and sing your praises. I'm not expecting a verbatim copy of 2e - I'd actually complain if that happened, too!
What I am expecting is to have the new additions to be well thought out, valid, and to be something that reinforces the nature of athas. A magical desert that is just "the normal desert trumped to 11" does not do it to me. Because the desert already should be at 11.
Essentially, saying "the feywild is like a worse place than the current land" is bad beans - because Athas should be hell to begin with. And to make it a better place goes against that, too - because then everyone would want to go there, danger or no. So what's the point of it being there?
