D&D 3E/3.5 drothgery's thoughts on 4e and WotC 3.5 classes that aren't in PH1

[ravenight]

Barbarian - <snip> they're going to be STR primary/DEX secondary/WIS tertiary characters (yes, high-CON barbarians are traditional, they're not getting heavy armor, so they'll need DEX or INT for defense, snd INT's not stereotypical for barbarians either -- and they ought to need at least one mental stat).

Not sure they need to have a mental stat - str/dex/con seems reasonable to me. You want barbarians to have high strength, good reaction speed and high endurance, so I suspect it will be those three, with con playing into rage and dex into some of the utility stuff (plus I expect them to have stealth as a class skill). Maybe there will be two different styles of barb, though, with one focused on con and the other on dex.

Druid - WotC has said they're Primal Hybrid in class and role, focused on shapeshifting, and gave some vague hints they'd be able to stand in for a cleric. So while a 3.5 Druid could fill any 4e role, I'm going to guess the 4e is a hybrid Striker/Leader (and can't really do controller stuff or defender stuff well).

Leader/controller makes more sense to me, though I suppose it depends a lot on what types of things they shape-shift into.

Sorcerer - Since these guys basically existed in 3.x to give a spontaneous caster, and someone else that used all of those wizard spells, it's no real surprise that the 4e version is getting a substantial reflavoring -- and at the end of the day mostly exists to give another controller option.

I believe sorcerer as a controller is confirmed, so I'm not going to argue that they aren't doing that, but I find it a little strange. The sorcerer always struck me as being more of a striker-type: launching huge spells and overcoming obstacles with brute magical force, instead of the wizard's tendency to study the situation and be prepared to handle it.

 

[Spatula]

I'm hoping for a druid that is a leader/controller. Ultimately the class is a spellcaster, so I think that focusing on the shapeshifting (which was never very impressive, combat-wise, before 3e) should be spun off into something new. The conversion ideas from WotC sort-of back that up, as there the shapeshifting is just used for moving around.

 

[Norhg]

I would be happy if the Monk was a defender, a sort of "mobility defender" who topples and grapples foes to keep them controlled, their great speed mitigating damage

 

[Surgoshan]

I'd like to see barbarians as being defenders that need high Con, Int, and Cha. The charisma would fit the force of will bit that involves rages, shouts, and the like. Intelligence: where the fighter and paladin are taught their skills (particularly the paladin), the barbarian figures it out on his own; it also gives them an excuse for why he has the stat he needs to boost his AC. Con because rather than felling people with might blows, his shtick is that he runs forty miles, climbs over the walls, and then fights for five hours.

 

[drothgery]

I'm hoping for a druid that is a leader/controller. Ultimately the class is a spellcaster, so I think that focusing on the shapeshifting (which was never very impressive, combat-wise, before 3e) should be spun off into something new. The conversion ideas from WotC sort-of back that up, as there the shapeshifting is just used for moving around.

I'd prefer to do it that way (I'd be fine if summoning and shapeshifting stayed largely dead in 4e), but it seems like WotC's not doing that; it looks like they're spinning the 'caster' druid into a shaman class.

I would be happy if the Monk was a defender, a sort of "mobility defender" who topples and grapples foes to keep them controlled, their great speed mitigating damage

Both Races and Classes and the suggested 'temp monk' (a tweaked twf ranger) strongly suggest the monk's a striker. And a ki power source almost has to be the monk's. I'm not saying an unarmed defender wouldn't be doable, but I don't think it's what the 4e monk will be.

 

[Surgoshan]

I'm not saying an unarmed defender wouldn't be doable, but I don't think it's what the 4e monk will be.

Good. I want a Zangief class.

 

[Celebrim]

I think you are overlooking that many of these classes which seem to have no design space left to them can easily be reinvented as paragon paths.

 

[drothgery]

I think you are overlooking that many of these classes which seem to have no design space left to them can easily be reinvented as paragon paths.

Possibly. But so could a great many prestige classes, and I was just looking at their viability as core classes.

 

[Gradine]

the truenamer did in fact have healing powers (in specific, it granted five rounds of fast healing) so healing/damage over time powers definitely fit with what that class was capable of.

i had an incarnum user that I've been struggling to find a replica of, though incarnates generally had the ability to fill all of the roles.