DrSpunj's Class Balance Spreadsheet
- Thread starter DrSpunj
- Start date
DrSpunj
Explorer
Sravoff said:
No problem on the updates. As far as a PDF version goes, that's a bit more difficult. I can easily print them as PDFs rather than Word or Excel files, that's not a big deal at all. The problem is the system is really based on being able to tinker with the cost of things, and for that you really need the spreadsheet.
The system we're using is balanced according to the CP Worksheet, and I feel comfortable saying it's working well for us. True, we're making adjustments as we need to when they come up, but they're small & minor, nothing that has really affected the underpinnings of the original system. Now, you might very well look at how I've valued things (like what a +1 save is worth vs an extra couple hit points, or a +1 BAB) and decide I'm a kook.
And with the spreadsheet you could then revalue each item and see whether you can get the classes to spread out across the point spectrum in a way that better matches your own views of their relative power.OTOH, if you just want to view the pages of the spreadsheet (rather than tinker and manipulate them) I could try printing/outputting the various spreadsheet sheets and see how they look. I don't have the full version of Reader, so I can't easily put them in a single, combined PDF, but I could certainly output each sheet as a PDF and upload them so you could look things over.
Let me know.
(And can I just say that thread subscription is a wonderful thing!)
DrSpunj
DrSpunj
Explorer
Zoatebix said:
No, should I? I've seen the name thrown around but haven't really chased down what they've done with the system. I really like a lot of the Green Ronin material, so I'll try and find the time to check it out.
On the flipside, have you checked out Monte & Mearls' Iron Heroes, Z?
Zoatebix
Working on it
True20 probably isn't immediately applicable to your work, but it is so very much worth checking out. True 20 (with a little bit of the FUDGE based game FATE --which you should most certainly also check out-- thrown in) is going to be the core of my Sci-Fantasy campaign, but I'm still toying with adopting some of your work and going classless. Still, the three 'roles' of True 20 are almost as good as classless...DrSpunj said:No, should I? I've seen the name thrown around but haven't really chased down what they've done with the system. I really like a lot of the Green Ronin material, so I'll try and find the time to check it out.
On the flipside, have you checked out Monte & Mearls' Iron Heroes, Z?
I didn't have Iron Heroes on pre-order but I did get it on the first or second day it after it hit stores. I'm still reading through it, but I definately like what I see. At first glance, it seems harder to loot for ideas than Arcana Evolved. Running and playing in both an IH and an AE game are high on my list of priorities --but no running them until I finish my own ruleset and get my campaign out of its 2-year hiatus.
Zoatebix
Working on it
Oh yeah - FATE is an OGL game as well (though other than using Wizard's license, it has nothing to do with the d20 system). Here're a link with easy access to the Fate SRD: http://www.faterpg.com/dl/
DrSpunj
Explorer
SSquirrel said:
I've just done a quick & dirty version of the Ritual Warrior as a straight conversion from AE. See below for the file. It is on par with the Magister right at 12.0 Avg CPs/Lvl. I haven't seen one in play, but as soon as AE came out I did add the following feats to the Feat Cheat Sheet:
Ability Focus (Base, 5 CPs)
This special ceremony helps one realize some of their inner potential by increasing one ability score by +1. This increase is identical to--but in addition to--the ability score increase that all characters gain every four levels.
Ritual Combat (Base, 5 CPs)
Prereqs: Wisdom 11+
You can use three 1st-rank combat rites per day. If you can access combat rites already, these three combat rites add to the existing number of 1st-rank rites the character can use in a day. Special: A character may take this feat more than once, gaining three more
combat rites per day. If taken more than once you may be able to access higher-rank rites (limited by Wisdom score as in AE), however you must always have more uses of the previous rank before gaining any or additional uses of a higher rank, and all three rites gained at a time apply to the same rank.
That last one is more complex than I'd like, but I was trying to stick with a single feat that would allow an approximation of the Combat Rites scalability in AE according to the class's table. With this feat you have to purchase Ritual Combat twice, gaining 6 1st level rites, before you could gain any 2nd level rites by taking it a third time. To get 3rd level rites you'd have to have taken the feat at least 5 times (3 for 1st level so 9 rites/day, and 2 for 2nd level so 6 rites/day).
Since you can only take the feat once each level it means you can't get 2nd level rites until minimum 3rd level which is a level later than AE, but then you get 3 of them right away, which is 1 more than AE gives you at 3rd level. IIRC it's a reasonably fair approximation of AE's Ritual Warrior assuming you take Ritual Combat every level.
SSquirrel said:
Very well I think! The group just hit level 7 last week. We're still playing every 4 weeks, or there abouts, and I've been arbitrarily handing out 3-4 CPs each session, so they gain a level each quarter of the year. I think it's a pace everyone is happy with. Most are able to "purchase" something (or more than one) each session, and even for the expensive stuff like Advanced Magic it's no more than 1 additional session.
Everyone likes the IH Skill Groups and , though I'm not seeing a lot of Combat or Skill Stunts yet in play.
We've made some serious adjustments to Saves & Defense in the last few months. We've revamped saves to be +1 to all three saves free every odd level, and it costs 1 CP to raise a single save by +1 on even levels (max +1 to any save, so 3 CPs max).
For Defense we've converted entirely to Iron Heroes so Armor becomes Damage Reduction. Defense then is the best way to avoid being hit (along with Dex, and with two Martial Artists out of 5 PCs, Wisdom isn't too far behind). We're in the midst of discussing how to tone down Defense a bit, which we had been trying at +1 for free every odd level, and +1 max on even levels for 2 CPs. Problem was everyone was maxing it and I, as the DM, was having a lot of problems hitting everyone! I didn't like having to min-max every opponent the PCs had, so we're trying to figure out how to best make things work here. IH does a great job on its own, but when you mix Dwarves in (with their "avoid armor speed reduction" ability) it becomes a little trickier.
Gwarh
Explorer
I'm quite interested as well to see if your Spreadsheet has seen anything new implimented. Or that is to say you and your group have made changes and additions and they are yet to be added to the current/downloadable Excel workbooks you've linked here.
I've found your work to be a huuuuuuuuge help in my own work on creating balanced Classes, for a d20 Fantasy Campaign in the style of HackMaster and Castles & Crusades.
Anything new or in particular thoughts on your work as you look back on it would be much appreciated.
I've found your work to be a huuuuuuuuge help in my own work on creating balanced Classes, for a d20 Fantasy Campaign in the style of HackMaster and Castles & Crusades.
Anything new or in particular thoughts on your work as you look back on it would be much appreciated.
