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5E Dual Wielder Feat Fix

ManBagel

Messing up everything in DnD since 2019
You master fighting with two weapons, gaining the following benefits:
  • You gain a +1 bonus to AC while you are wielding a separate melee weapon in each hand.

  • You can use two-weapon fighting even when the one handed melee weapons you are wielding aren’t light.

  • You can draw or stow two one-handed weapons when you would normally be able to draw or stow only one.
  • When you attack and hit with your main attack you can make the second attack without using your bonus action.
 

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doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
You master fighting with two weapons, gaining the following benefits:
  • You gain a +1 bonus to AC while you are wielding a separate melee weapon in each hand.

  • You can use two-weapon fighting even when the one handed melee weapons you are wielding aren’t light.

  • You can draw or stow two one-handed weapons when you would normally be able to draw or stow only one.
  • When you attack and hit with your main attack you can make the second attack without using your bonus action.
I’d change the quick draw part to “you can draw a weapon with each hand as part of the same action, and whenever you attack with a weapon you can draw that weapon as part of the same attack, even if you have done so before this turn.

So throwers get a boost.
 




Xeviat

Adventurer
Supporter
It's one of the more obvious fixes for TWF. Best discussion of the problem and possible solutions is here: 5E - Improving Two-Weapon Fighting
I've been using this in my games for a while, and it's really good. You do have to change Hunter's Mark and Hex, though. I've made those Ranger and Warlock class abilities, have the damage only be once per round, leave both as 1 hour, but scale the damage to 1d6 at 1st level slot, 1d8 at 2nd level, up to 1d12 at 4th.

It makes the balance scale against Smite better: a 4th level smite is 5d8 damage, or 22.5. damage. 1d12 Hunter's mark/Hex is 6.5 damage per round, so 19.5 at 3 hits and 26 at 4 hits, so slower to build but can go higher in drawn out fights. It works out well. Since Hunter's mark and Hex are class abilities, they don't have concentration in my variant.
 

wizard71

Explorer
Using your bonus action for two weapon fighting balances it out. The only errata I would add to dual wield feat is quick draw for both weapons as part of the bonus action
 



NotAYakk

Legend
My variant.

Dueling Fighting Style reads: You gain a +2 bonus to damage with melee weapons you wield with one hand. You can draw a weapon as part of the action you attack with it.

TWF style is eliminated.

The Two-Weapon Fighting rule reads:

On your turn you can do at most one of the following:
  • If you made an attack with a light melee weapon, you can make an attack with a different light weapon you are wielding as a bonus action.
  • If you make an attack with a light melee weapon as part of a bonus action, you can make an attack with a different light weapon you are wielding as part of that action.


Dual Wielder reads:
  • You can add your attribute bonus to damage when two weapon fighting.
  • You can use Two Weapon Fighting even if your weapons are not light
  • As part of the attack action, if you hit a creature with a weapon while you have advantage, you can use the lower roll to attack the same target with a weapon you hold in your other hand.
  • You gain a +1 bonus to AC when wielding two weapons you are proficient in.

between these 3, a TWF has damage approaching a GWF when they have advantage. On low AC targets without advantage, GWF wins.

Finally, the dagger counts as offhand, and can be used with TWF even if your main hand weapon isn't light.

Note that "one hand short sword, off-hand loaded xbow" works without a feat.

You still cannot rage+TWF bonus action attack on your first turn, but Dual Wielder works great with reckless attack (much as it does with GWM).

Level 1, 16 stat
2d6+7 (TWF) = 14
2d6+3 (reroll 1s and 2s) = 11.33
1d8+5 (S+B) = 9.5

Level 2, 16 stat, action surge round
3d6+12 (TWF) = 22.5
4d6+6 (reroll 1s and 2s) = 22.67
2d8+10 (S+B) = 19

Level 5, with feat boost
3d8+15 (TWF) = 28.5
3d10+1d4+12 (PAM, reaction) = 34
2d8+12 (S+B, Stat) = 21

Level 5, with feat(s) boost and advantage
5d8+20 (TWF, Advantage (split)) = 42.5
3d10+1d4+52 (PAM, GWF, GWM, reaction, advantage and -5 to hit +10 to damage) = 73.9
2d8+12 (S+B, Stat) = 21

Level 5, feat boost, Action surge and advantage
9d8+36 (TWF, Advantage (split)) = 76.5
5d10+1d4+78 (GWF, PAM, reaction, GWM, advantage and -5 to hit +10 to damage) = 112.5
4d8+24 (S+B, Stat) = 42

Level 20, flaming weapons, feats boost, 25 strength belt
5d8+10d6+45 (TWF) = 102.5
5d10+1d4+12d6+52 (GWF, PAM, reaction) = 128.5 (+50 with GWM if target has low AC)
4d8+36 (S+B) =54

Level 20, flaming weapons, feats boost, advantage, 25 strength belt
9d8+18d6+81 (TWF, Advantage(split)) = 184.5
5d10+1d4+12d6+102 (GWF, GWM, PAM, reaction) = 178.5
4d8+36 (S+B) =54

Level 20, action surge, flaming weapons, feats boost, advantage, 25 strength belt
17d8+34d6+153 (TWF, Advantage(split)) = 348.5
9d10+1d4+20d6+270 (GWF, GWM, PAM, reaction) = 399.7
8d8+72 (S+B) =108
 
Last edited:

Xeviat

Adventurer
Supporter
My fix balances TWFing with two-handers.

Twin shortswords is 1d6+stat plus 1d6, greatsword is 2d6+Str. My fighting style let's you twf with non-light weapons, so you go to 2d8+stat combined while great weapon gets the rerolls.

The rogue gets a buff in this situation if they go melee, since they have a higher chance to land sneak attack, but ranged rogues have hide (and aim if you allow the variant) to get advantage.

I haven't decided if the TWFing feat should give the ability bonus back.
 


jmartkdr2

Adventurer
How so? TWF requires two weapons, PAM requires one...
If you're dual-wielding quarterstaffs or spears, you could use this feat for the offhand attack as part of the Attack Action, and then use your bonus action to make an attack with the butt end of one of your weapons.
 

TwoSix

Unserious gamer
Supporter
If you're dual-wielding quarterstaffs or spears, you could use this feat for the offhand attack as part of the Attack Action, and then use your bonus action to make an attack with the butt end of one of your weapons.
Don't even need to dual-wield staves or spears, just need one. That would enable a spear+longsword combo, which is kind of awesome.
 

Don't even need to dual-wield staves or spears, just need one. That would enable a spear+longsword combo, which is kind of awesome.
You can do that now with the feat as is.

TWF as a whole was probably the single player concept I spent the most time on coming up with new rules that both empowered players who wanted to choose this style and kept it within a reasonable damage range.

The current version I use:
Base rule changes
  • You can draw/stow two weapons as part of the same item interaction
  • Thrown weapons can be drawn as part of an attack
  • If a class provides a fighting style you an pick any of them.
Fighting style change
  • Protection and defense are rolled into one
  • Two weapon fighting allows non light weapons and +1 AC while duel wielding. (Roughly ~1 increase damage per attack and middle ground for damage and defense.
Feat change
  • Add ablity modifier to off hand attack
  • When you make the attack with your offhand and have advantage, you can forgo advantage to make two attacks instead. If the weapon is thrown you must supply two of them.
It was a lot of changes to make but it address the problem that twf was both a tad to much in the very early levels but quickly falls off. I also didn't just want another -hit/+damage feat so I found the sweet spot of an single additional attack.
 

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