WotC Dungeons & Dragons Fans Seek Removal of Oriental Adventures From Online Marketplace

[Umbran]

Not rediculously unimportant to me. I'm not a fan of censorship.

This isn't multitasking. This is absurdity.

So, when it is important to you, it is okay and worthy of argument, but when it is important to them, it is absurdity?

Good to know that's how this is being considered...

 

[Umbran]

Aldarc I'd be happy to discuss the offending material like it was analysed with orcs and vistani.
Please highlight the issues that are the cause of offense.

Mod Note:

NO. STOP.

We just had those threads, and they had to be closed because folks could not manage the discussion. Continuing the same type of argument on a slightly different target is not appropriate.

 

[Cadence]

This isn't multitasking. This is absurdity.
Have you even watched the video or do you just accept anything told to you?

I read the article and the entire thread up to this point. I read the blogs posts and most of the other things posted about orcs. My time for multitasking didn't include the two hours for watching part 0 of the podcast. Did you? (If so, did I read right that there are multiple parts?).

PoP culturism is also fascinating. I didn't know we were now striving for realism and accuracy within D&D.
Cannot wait for you to start the petition to rename the Medusa a Gorgon.

The PF Bestiary 5 had the Chuspiki which seems to match something from popular culture. Feels like it should be possible to use pop culture without grabbing all the shallow stereotypes as hard as possible.

It doesn't feel like a jump over a ledge to get to Medusa/Gorgon instead of just a bit down the slippery slope?

 

[Sadras]

@Umbran.
The thread topic is about some fans requesting the removal of OA.
If we are not discussing the issues the fans have presented to make their case for the removal of the OA, then what exactly is being discussed here?

 

[Giltonio_Santos]

This situation somehow remembers me of a post in my favorite band's Facebook when they went to the US for the first time after more than a decade without playing there. The post said something like "Yes, after all that time, we'll tour the Western Hemisphere again!" Well, the only problem was that not even six months had passed since they had toured Brazil and the rest of SA for the last time. Apparently we were not Occidental enough for their social media.

From what I know, the concept and basic ideas around "Orientalism" are not given for sure even in the field of anthropology. Edward Said is the kind of guy who has a lot of fans, but is very far from being an unanimity. Zeb Cook, on the other hand, was genuinely interested in Japanese culture, working with the kind of source that a guy like him could get in 1985, and trying to present that stuff to D&D gamers in the best light he could. It hurts me that people are seeking the removal of books that, if a bit outdated, do not carry a single moment of hate speech. This is just book burning, and I wouldn't be fool to believe that those who are seeking to start this process will be willing to stop before only the things that they find appropriate are allowed to go public and be sold. I hope WotC do not pay attention to this plea or any other of similar nature.

 

[Mecheon]

Really how many Asian people were in the RPG industry back in 1985?

There were actually quite a few people in Japan trying to get a licenced version of D&D brought over there. But, well, TSR didn't.

Anywho long story short that's why Record of Lodoss War is a thing

This is just book burning, and I wouldn't be fool to believe that those who are seeking to start this process will be willing to stop before only the things that they find appropriate are allowed to go public and be sold. I hope WotC do not pay attention to this plea or any other of similar nature.

Its hardly book burning. Its moreso "WotC leaving these up there is sort of a bygone conclusion they are completely fine with the content of this book being publicly available with no warnings or comments about it". And OA is a mess

 

[Umbran]

If we are not discussing the issues the fans have presented to make their case for the removal of the OA, then what exactly is being discussed here?

Mod Note:

That's not for me to determine. Maybe there's nothing you find of interest in this thread. You're free to find others that do interest you.

But, we will not be having another, "this depiction is offensive/no it isn't," discussion thread at this time.

 

[Bagpuss]

You should probably look into that a little more then.

The same is true for the people asking for OA to be removed from the marketplace, watching their podcast it is clear they don't have much knowledge of old D&D.

They have a real go at Comeliness, claiming only Asian characters get it as it is featured in OA, but that's because they don't realise it was just introduced in Unearthed Arcana (for the traditional setting). I mean their other complaints about Comeliness are fine, and you know maybe that's why hardly anyone used it and it didn't survive later editions.

They complain about minimum and maximum stats for certain races/classes, but that's just how D&D was done back then, it isn't racist it's just a D&D was played differently back then.

 

[Sadras]

I read the article and the entire thread up to this point. I read the blogs posts and most of the other things posted about orcs. My time for multitasking didn't include the two hours for watching part 0 of the podcast. Did you? (If so, did I read right that there are multiple parts?).

You are correct there are multiple parts. I have only seen the first one and I was not impressed. Granted my view is but 1 opinion. @Bagpuss makes a summary of most of the issues in the 1st part.

But @Umbran has now forbidden any discussion on the issues which supposedly cause offense to the individuals.

The PF Bestiary 5 had the Chuspiki which seems to match something from popular culture. Feels like it should be possible to use pop culture without grabbing all the shallow stereotypes as hard as possible.

It doesn't feel like a jump over a ledge to get to Medusa/Gorgon instead of just a bit down the slippery slope?

That is can be done is not my issue.
My issue is the call for the removal of the material.
It was already unnecesarily done with The Community episode. Now we are moving to OA.

 

[Cadence]

That is can be done is not my issue.
My issue is the call for the removal of the material.
It was already unnecesarily done with The Community episode. Now we are moving to OA.

I am a fan of putting the explanatory page at the front (like was brought up elsewhere with Gone with the Wind). If the issue is making money from it, then donating the proceeds to charity or putting it at a no-profit price point would fix that.