Dungeons & Dragons Releases New Unearthed Arcana Subclasses, Strongly Hinting at Dark Sun

Wizards of the Coast has released four new D&D subclasses for playtesting, all of which have heavy thematic ties to the post-apocalyptic Dark Sun setting. The four subclasses, released as "Apocalyptic Subclasses," include the Circle of Preservation Druid, the Gladiator Fighter, the Defiled Sorcerer, and the Sorcerer-King Patron Warlock. Although not stated outright, the Gladiator and Sorcerer-King Patron are explicit nods to the Dark Sun setting, set in a ruined world ruled by Sorcerer-Kings where gladiatorial fights were common.

The Circle of Preservation Druid creates areas of preserved land that grants buffs to those who stand upon it. The Gladiator adds secondary Weapon Mastery properties to their attacks, with bonus abilities. Notably, the Gladiator uses Charisma as its secondary stat. The Defiled Sorcerer can expend its hit dice to amp up damage to its attacks and can also steal the life of its targets to deal additional damage. The Sorcerer-King Patron gains a number of abilities tying into tyranny and oppression, with the ability to cast Command as a Bonus Action without expending a spell slot, causing targets to gain the Frightened Condition, and forcing those who attack them to re-roll successful attacks.

The survey for the subclasses goes live on August 28th.

 

[pukunui]

Well, you're not saying stuff should be sanitized, but when a large number of people comes together and keep making a problem out of things that are ultimately up to how people like to play games themselves and how creatives like to make the settings they want, and they frame it in such a way that the problem isn't just a disagreement on tastes or personal preferences but, well, a social issue (be it that we shouldn't encourage villainous playstyles because we live in, er, bad times, as opposed to the good old days, or how this and that trope can potentially be interpreted as discriminatory or offensive because X and Y), what do you think ends up happening?

Creatives get very careful with what they make out of fear of creating a controversy even out of a honest mistake, aka, a chilling effect on creatives; publishers get stricter with what they allow to be published, because they like money and safe products; consumers get less of the stuff they want because some stuff is now risque to make and there's a moral panic in act again. Stuff ends up getting sanitized, and in TTRPG environments this seems particularly severe.

Sure, and I have already stated that I'm fine with defiling and ex-templars etc. I just don't like the specific mechanics presented in the UA, and I don't think WotC should be encouraging that specific kind of playstyle in the context of Dark Sun.

I think there are more creative ways they could present things like defiling magic and anti-heroes than these specific subclasses.

This is a lot more general than people playing bad guys and your specific case here obviously, this is not about you specifically. What I'm getting at here is that it's really bizarre for me to see how in TTRPG circles it became somehow controversial to portray seemingly slavery in any way, even the regular version with the slavers as cartoon villains to be slaughtered on sight as the crowd cheers (imagine what kind of reactions it would spark to make an actual nuanced take on the phenomenon, like how it would be to explore a society like those of the ancient world where slavery was widespread and considered not evil at all but rather an ineliminable part of human society!), while in other mediums Dark Fantasy full of racism, slavery and sexual abuse remains largely mainstream.

As others have already pointed out in this thread, I think the main issue with the way slavery has been portrayed in the Dark Sun setting specifically stems from the fact that TSR chose to use antibellum US-style chattel slavery rather than classical era Roman/Greek/etc slavery. The latter would have fit Dark Sun's vibes better anyway, so it's a bit of a mystery why they chose the former.

 

[Scribe]

The latter would have fit Dark Sun's vibes better anyway, so it's a bit of a mystery why they chose the former.

Because everything (it sure feels like) is filtered through an American bias.

 

[pukunui]

Because everything (it sure feels like) is filtered through an American bias.

Yes, probably. I mean, they made an effort to give the setting a classical civilizations vibe -- not-Aztecs, not-Romans, not-Greeks, etc -- but had a bit of a blind spot about slavery, I guess. Or maybe they just felt American-style chattel slavery was more blatantly evil and didn't want to go with a more nuanced approach?

 

[Parmandur]

Or maybe they just felt American-style chattel slavery was more blatantly evil and didn't want to go with a more nuanced approach?

TSR never, ever wanted to go with a more nuanced approach: that wasn't their way.

 

[pukunui]

TSR never, ever wanted to go with a more nuanced approach: that wasn't their way.

Touché!

OK, now I really am going to go away and do some other things! I'll catch up on the ensuing discussions later.

 

[Zardnaar]

Because everything (it sure feels like) is filtered through an American bias.

Pukunui is a yank he just doesn't live there. He is doubly cursed from my PoV American and living in Auckland.

Its not 2019 though. WotC has done a 180 on no to Darksun. There's nothing in DS original printing that wasn't in BG3 or worse.

WotC likes money. On book scan there newer stuff (broadly speaking pist Tashas) didn't sell well compared to older stuff.

I expect a few changes that's fine but if depends on how much they file down. OBS solves a lot of the problems in DS anyway as alot was added later.

The "new generation suff" appeal mostly failed anyway. They wont buy bad product and a lot of post Tashas stuff has a poor reputation. My FLGS has huge amounts of it sticking on the bookshelf. 19 copies of Strixgaven approx (25+ at one point). Even at 40% off sales they can't clear it.

Eberron has a fairly goid conversion. A somewhat faithful adaptation needs to lean a bit more towards BG3 in tone vs Dragonlance/Spelljammer/Planescape which no one seemed to care about even here.

 

[Remathilis]

nothing wrong with that, saying a class does not match its fiction is valid feedback too. At no time did WotC say the feedback has to be limited to the class features. If anything, they said it is not about getting feedback for their balance.

If WotC does not care for that feedback, they can ignore it, it’s not like they are required to make changes based on it

We don't know the fiction. We are making guesses based on what we THINK the fiction is based on older editions and a short blurb. It's one thing to say "I think the defiler sorcerer should have an ability that withers plants since the description says it does." And another to say "According to the Revised box set for 2nd edition..." As if that is still gospel or relevant.

 

[Zardnaar]

We don't know the fiction. We are making guesses based on what we THINK the fiction is based on older editions and a short blurb. It's one thing to say "I think the defiler sorcerer should have an ability that withers plants since the description says it does." And another to say "According to the Revised box set for 2nd edition..." As if that is still gospel or relevant.

Well defiling plants should be there. What its effects are bit more open imho.

Change to much its not a good version of Dark Sun. And it will get Spelljammered.

 

[Remathilis]

Well defiling ants should be there. What its effects are.

Change to much its not a good version of Dark Sun. And it will get Spelljammered.

The problem is that we again are seeing one part of a tapestry and assuming we have seen it all. For example, the PDK was derided for not matching 2e Cormyr lore without knowing about the background (and feat) the new lore (still a mystery, but clearly the knights are bigger than just Cormyr). I wager when the books come out and people get the full context, we'll get what wotc was doing with the subclass. By then it will be too late.

We don't know the sum and total of defiling and preserving. We have seen two subclasses that focus on them, but like the PDK, we don't know what other mechanics (feats, backgrounds, spells) tie into them nor do we know what changes are being done. We know two subclasses and are inferring the rest based on outdated lore and occasionally incorrect recollections of them. You aren't there to veto the lore, you're their to see if that mechanical expression "feels" like a defiler.

 

[Demetrios1453]

Sure, and I have already stated that I'm fine with defiling and ex-templars etc. I just don't like the specific mechanics presented in the UA, and I don't think WotC should be encouraging that specific kind of playstyle in the context of Dark Sun.

I think there are more creative ways they could present things like defiling magic and anti-heroes than these specific subclasses.


As others have already pointed out in this thread, I think the main issue with the way slavery has been portrayed in the Dark Sun setting specifically stems from the fact that TSR chose to use antibellum US-style chattel slavery rather than classical era Roman/Greek/etc slavery. The latter would have fit Dark Sun's vibes better anyway, so it's a bit of a mystery why they chose the former.

It's not a mystery at all - it's simply because it's much more recent, and most of the writers were from the US. In the '90s, while better than previous decades, writers still weren't always terribly nuanced, and often wrote what they and their audience knew best.