[Eberron] Revisiting Warforged

[ARandomGod]

One way to challenge a warforged is make sure that penalties for armor actually count. A second level character is very ineffective with a -20-something modifier to his swim check. I'm in a game where my character with banded mail and steel tower shield has a -26 penalty to swim. Had to fight a water elemental in a flooded room, kept failing my swim check so I could only take a 5 ft step. Also I could not fight because I kept failing my swim check. Heavy armor hurts climbing. It also prevents (severly hampers) sneaking, jumping, and several other skills.

Keep track of weight. Adamantine is heavy. Do you think he's going to be fighting and charging across a rickety old rope bridge if he weight 400 to 500 lbs? Old run down house with rotted wooden floors. How much weight will it withstand before it collapses.

In a similiar situation a WF won't bother to make a swim check, He'll just walk (along the bottom, yes).

As for weight, yes... as a WF, around 400 lbs, you definitely won't go across that bridge at all, let alone fight or charge across it. But then, well, if for some reason it's necessary in the game to do these things, the GM is just trying to screw the player. I mean, it would be the same as having no crossing available at all. Not that such a thing is always bad, it might be challenging to have an obsticle that not everyone in the party can cross. But as a just "we'll show the WF that he weighs too much" tactic I would personally see it as a little crass.

 

[ARandomGod]

So should stuff like Necklace of Adaptation be free? Since its effects are just one in a list of things WF get? Couple hundred GP?

Not free, but if you pay an entire feat for it, sure, I'll let you have the feat "has a necklace of adaptation".

Can I pick up a Paralysis-Only Ring of Freedom of Movement for my high level character so I can stop getting geeked by Blasphemy? Like me one of them.

You most certainly can! It's discounted, cause it only works part of the time (against paralysis)

And some light fort armor. That's not very much either, I hear.

Well, I'd agree that it's not worth the price to get it. But if for some reason you want it, it's available.

 

[Tellerve]

I have Races of Eberron but not with me right now, ya know Thanksgiving and traveling and all, but I am fairly sure I read in there that Warforged float as much as humans do. Remember warforged aren't all metal and stone, but have wood and "other" organic material as well. I guess they could fail their saves and willingly sink, but I'm not sure how you'd do that if you don't have lungs to blow out air and change your buoyancy.

Tellerve

 

[Creeping Death]

In a similiar situation a WF won't bother to make a swim check, He'll just walk (along the bottom, yes).

As for weight, yes... as a WF, around 400 lbs, you definitely won't go across that bridge at all, let alone fight or charge across it. But then, well, if for some reason it's necessary in the game to do these things, the GM is just trying to screw the player. I mean, it would be the same as having no crossing available at all. Not that such a thing is always bad, it might be challenging to have an obsticle that not everyone in the party can cross. But as a just "we'll show the WF that he weighs too much" tactic I would personally see it as a little crass.

It's only screwing that player as much as an anti-magic zone screws spell-casters, an all city adventure screws druids and rangers, and undead screw rogues. They are called obstacles, it's only screwing the player if it happens ALL the time. There could be other ways around it, which there usually is.

As far as the swim checks are concerned, I don't think you can fight when you've failed. Meaning you are useless for that one encounter or series of encounters. At least that is the way that we played when we encountered a room that was flooded. I could only walk 5ft and was useless in combat. Thankfully we only had to fight two creatures. I'll have to look up the rules. But I think the way we handled that was good, being a land dweller you shouldn't be accustomed to fighting under sea.

 

[Klaus]

I have Races of Eberron but not with me right now, ya know Thanksgiving and traveling and all, but I am fairly sure I read in there that Warforged float as much as humans do. Remember warforged aren't all metal and stone, but have wood and "other" organic material as well. I guess they could fail their saves and willingly sink, but I'm not sure how you'd do that if you don't have lungs to blow out air and change your buoyancy.

Tellerve

Warforged has the same buoyancy as a human. Note that he gets a -5 penalty to Swim, which isn't double, like the actual armor check penalty from full plate is.

As a matter of fact, the warforged's Body feats don't have *armor check penalty*, but rather an unnamed penalty that is very similar to it.

 

[HeapThaumaturgist]

Meaning that a Warforged fighter with equivalent AC is actually better off on making Swim checks than a normal fighter.



And can't drown.

--fje

 

[Klaus]

Yeah, but they have worse Damage Reduction.

 

[ARandomGod]

It's only screwing that player as much as an anti-magic zone screws spell-casters, an all city adventure screws druids and rangers, and undead screw rogues. They are called obstacles, it's only screwing the player if it happens ALL the time. There could be other ways around it, which there usually is.

I was replying as if it were to be put in the game all the time. Sometimes, used as a story-advancement line... well in that case you may as well be glad you're a WF, the GM was going to put in an obsticle anyhow!

As far as the swim checks are concerned, I don't think you can fight when you've failed. Meaning you are useless for that one encounter or series of encounters. At least that is the way that we played when we encountered a room that was flooded. I could only walk 5ft and was useless in combat. Thankfully we only had to fight two creatures. I'll have to look up the rules. But I think the way we handled that was good, being a land dweller you shouldn't be accustomed to fighting under sea.

I'm pretty sure.. Lemme check.. Yes. The result of a swim check has nothing to do, per RAW, with your ability to fight or not. If you can't fight, or if fighting is hindered by the water, it'll be equally hindered no matter what swim check you make.

It's an interesting way to handle that, certainly. And it might make swim more useful... well, no, I'd still consider such a situational event an obstical and not something to be prepared for by wasting skill points in it.

Interestingly enough, it looks like you aren't even allowed a five foot step, however (if you fail). Which would be for swimming, has to be for swimming. There's no reason you can't just walk along the bottom. I mean, if you're walking, or pulling yourself somewhere under-water that's not a swim check at all.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

I
I'm pretty sure.. Lemme check.. Yes. The result of a swim check has nothing to do, per RAW, with your ability to fight or not. If you can't fight, or if fighting is hindered by the water, it'll be equally hindered no matter what swim check you make.

Not strictly true.

4 Creatures flailing about in the water (usually because they failed their Swim checks) have a hard time fighting effectively. An off-balance creature loses its Dexterity bonus to Armor Class, and opponents gain a +2 bonus on attacks against it.

 

[Peter Gibbons]

Warforged has the same buoyancy as a human.

True (silly, but true), but all that means is a warforged needs to carry about 16 pounds of gear in order to walk along the bottom.