Eden Studios Adds Drive-Thru Window

[Brown Jenkin]

Andy, you have my sympathy, I know what it is like to do what you are told and then take the heat for it.

As for Eden Studios, Welcome to the buzzsaw of anti-DRM sentiment. It seems White Wolf did not do enough market research before selling you on their services. I'm sure you are good guys in general, but some people feel so strongly about DRM that they feel the only way to show a company how they feel about it is not to do buisness with them at all. Right now the main bad guy is not realy you but DTRPG and their business model. It is nothing personal towards you, but the only way to convince DTRPG that their model is flawed is to take it out on DTRPGs clients. No clients = change in business model.

You made a business desicion and only time will tell whether it is the right one or not. Part of that decision is having to deal with the consequences of it. We have a choice of buying your products or not for whatever reason we choose. You have a choice of continuing to do business with DTRPG or not. Attacking your customers probably won't help things.

 

[kingpaul]

The (highly professional) response:

Boycotting the hardcopy sales because you dont like what we are doing with our PDF policy is TOTAL BULL.

Im sorry for sounding harsh but Im sick of the complaints.

Im trying to listen with an open mind but when you and others make comments like this - how can I? Now you are PERSONALLY attacking my business. For what end? What do you think you stand to achive by not supporting us?

I thought 'voting with your pocketbook' was a valid method for customers to show their displeasure at a company's actions? Ergo, what consumers like JavaDragon hope to achieve is that companies will not sell DRM PDF files.

 

[francisca]

Damn! These are people too you know! Yes, it's not as professional as one might have hoped, but have you seen some of these posts? Some people just signed up at ENworld to spout crap, yes we're not happy with Adobe DRM, but do we need to get rude about it? I'm not suprised that a publisher couldn't handle the storm of awfull comments and made a passionate statement. What i am suprised about is that after all this crap, press releases like these are still being posted, even if it was by people like Andy "The Fall Guy"...

In regards to whether I have seen the posts on rpg.net that prompted his response. No. I have not. Except for reading the occasional review over there, I stay out of that place. So in that regard, you are correct, and I can see your point. The main reason I don't bother with the rpg.net forms is because the personal attacks from both consumers and publishers are ridiculous. (Bruce Baugh's rant telling folks who thought HM deserved it's Gama award were beneath him, and he didn't want them buying his products, is what drove me off).

So, for the record, I hope nobody loses their job and can feed their kids, and can continue making a living in the RPG industry.

However, as he said, Eden made a business decision. They have to abide by it as well. I too have chosen not to purchase any print products from any publisher taking part in DriveThruRPG (should they ditch DRM, I'll gladly shell out some money there and probably by some hardbacks as well). Telling me (albeit indirectly) that my stance is BS, in light of my personal privacy and security concerns, is not very endearing, and is likely to linger in my mind when looking to spend money on RPGs.

 

[thundershot]

I'll vote with my pocketbook, and I won't buy the PDFs at DTRPG. This has nothing to do with print copies. If they sell a ton of print, and no PDFs (especially if they sold them via rpgnet), it will tell the various companies something.

I'll be damned if I'm going to stop buying PRINT products just to spite the company's decision about pdfs...


Chris

 

[Cergorach]

Telling me (albeit indirectly) that my stance is BS, in light of my personal privacy and security concerns, is not very endearing, and is likely to linger in my mind when looking to spend money on RPGs.

To be honest, and i'm not saying your stance is BS, i find the whole privacy issue getting a bit... strange. If people where really that paranoid, they shouldn't post so much on public boards, 700+ posts is more then enough to get a decent psychological profile. IP is logged on this site, vBullitin isn't the most secure software out there, IP trace is pretty decent these dys. And i'm guessing your not working through an ananymous proxy. You post your location, e-mail address, hobbies, and proffesion for all to see. I even know where you are at certain dates: http://moria.ecn.purdue.edu/francisca/gc04.html ;-)
How is the info that you have to deposit at the Adobe DRM server any different?

 

[francisca]

To be honest, and i'm not saying your stance is BS, i find the whole privacy issue getting a bit... strange. If people where really that paranoid, they shouldn't post so much on public boards, 700+ posts is more then enough to get a decent psychological profile. IP is logged on this site, vBullitin isn't the most secure software out there, IP trace is pretty decent these dys. And i'm guessing your not working through an ananymous proxy. You post your location, e-mail address, hobbies, and proffesion for all to see. I even know where you are at certain dates: http://moria.ecn.purdue.edu/francisca/gc04.html ;-)
How is the info that you have to deposit at the Adobe DRM server any different?

Sure. I see your point. First of all, I chose to make all of that info available, and to me the risk of it being exploited is low enough to warrant it.

However, I really don't want to start getting spam from someone offering products based on the profile adobe built on me based on what RPG products I bought. And don't get me started about Passport...

In addition, the DRM stuff is just one more doorknob waiting to be twisted, form a security standpoint.

So, I'm in a position of compromise. I could stop posting on messageboards, never do business on the internet, board up my windows, etc... But I have chosen not too. I am also exercising my right to choose (as much as possible) to limit who gets my information, no matter how insignificant. I am also choosing to limit, again, to a degree, ways into my systems. Just because there are already a million ways for privacy to be expolited and my system's security breached doesn't mean I should keep adding to it.

But I see your point, as well. It's a balancing act, and varies from person to person. To me, DRM tips the balance beam in the wrong direction.

edit:

and then there is the whole idea of having to check in with someone whenever I want to use the file. That I do not like. others have already expressed those feelings, so my bitches and moans have centered around privacy and security, which trump everything, in my eyes.

 

[Henry]

If people where really that paranoid, they shouldn't post so much on public boards, 700+ posts is more then enough to get a decent psychological profile. IP is logged on this site, vBullitin isn't the most secure software out there, IP trace is pretty decent these dys. And i'm guessing your not working through an ananymous proxy. You post your location, e-mail address, hobbies, and proffesion for all to see. I even know where you are at certain dates: http://moria.ecn.purdue.edu/francisca/gc04.html ;-)
How is the info that you have to deposit at the Adobe DRM server any different?

No one has to register credit card info to get to ENWorld; when credit card or Paypal info gets exchanged, it's a whole different ballgame to identity thieves/miners.

Just the inability or unwillingness for Professional print houses to accept DRM PDF's is a big off-putting point. It IS worth buying the print copies more than having to deal with skittish printers.

 

[francisca]

If people where really that paranoid, they shouldn't post so much on public boards

Just because you are paranoid, doesn't mean people aren't out to get you....

 

[DaveMage]

I'll vote with my pocketbook, and I won't buy the PDFs at DTRPG. This has nothing to do with print copies. If they sell a ton of print, and no PDFs (especially if they sold them via rpgnet), it will tell the various companies something.

I'll be damned if I'm going to stop buying PRINT products just to spite the company's decision about pdfs...

Chris

I think this sums up my feelings on the matter as well.

 

[Bagpuss]

I'll vote with my pocketbook, and I won't buy the PDFs at DTRPG. This has nothing to do with print copies. If they sell a ton of print, and no PDFs (especially if they sold them via rpgnet), it will tell the various companies something.

I have to agree, I'm not going to change my print buying habits significantly but I won't be buying PDF's through DTRPG. And that will effect my purchase habits for some companies. I have perviously bought a PDF as a preview of something liked it and then ordered the book through my FLGS. My FLGS owner tends to know that I read the reviews and have a good insight into what's hot, so frequently gets extras of what I order. With no PDF previews I won't be ordering certain products in future. So it could indirectly effect print sales.

I'll be damned if I'm going to stop buying PRINT products just to spite the company's decision about pdfs...

I agree but I've previously decided no to buy products because the owner or writer of a product has been rude and obnoxious on the internet.