Elemental Planes Killed

[Wormwood]

Silly me.

Indeed.

 

[Pale]

Indeed.

::rollseyes::

 

[Nifft]

If I play it differently, am I having wrong bad fun?

If I like the change and play with it, am I having wrong bad fun?

Yes. And if you keep it up, you're going to lose that other hand, too.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Lackhand]

Funny, that's what my parents said.

-- Lack "Where'd all this hair come from?" Ooi.

 

[see]

"The Elemental Planes"? Wait, which cosmology are you talking about.

The standard D&D cosmology. You know, as presented in the core D&D rules for the last thirty years? As the standard? Trying to pretend that it's "just another cosmology" like those presented in third-party products or one campaign setting is disingenuous, and you know that — or at least you should.

And yes, Necromancer Games will take the corpse of the Elemental Planes and work their magic on them, keeping them ambulatory, but they'll still be dead, cut off from the lifegiving force of being an official, supported, D&D product.

 

[broghammerj]

The standard D&D cosmology. You know, as presented in the core D&D rules for the last thirty years? As the standard? Trying to pretend that it's "just another cosmology" like those presented in third-party products or one campaign setting is disingenuous, and you know that — or at least you should.

And yes, Necromancer Games will take the corpse of the Elemental Planes and work their magic on them, keeping them ambulatory, but they'll still be dead, cut off from the lifegiving force of being an official, supported, D&D product.

I agree with you 100%!

What I love is how everyone defending the changes is taking examples of cosmology from Eberron, Planescape, Ravenloft, Forgotten Realms, etc and saying it's different from traditional DnD cosmology. Well it should be since they are setting books and not core.

 

[mhacdebhandia]

The Great Wheel is just Greyhawk's cosmology.

I don't believe that the majority of games, even in First Edition, used the Manual of the Planes cosmology. I suspect that most games never addressed the issue of other planes of existence, either.

 

[Baby Samurai]

It’s really no big deal; you’ve always been able to go with any cosmology you like.

Look at FR, some people still consider it part of the Great Wheel/Planescape (like me) and others implement the new Tree cosmology.

Krynn, I still consider it part of Planescape and Takhisis is merely an aspect of Tiamat, but some people have embraced the new Cosmology that came along in the Dragonlance d20 hardcover.

Now Dark Sun was interesting, because in the Dragon Kings hardcover they suggested that it was in its own Alternate Material plane with its own Elemental planes etc, but the Spacefarers Handbook and Ravenloft suggested that Dark Sun (athas) was part of the Planescape/Spelljammer cosmology in a closed crystal sphere. And in the 3.5 Dark Sun articles in Dragon they separated in into its own cosmology like FR, Krynn and Eberron.

Speaking of Eberron, I consider it part of the Great Wheel/Planescape in my current Planescape campaign, but that doesn’t mean I couldn’t run an Eberron campaign and use its particular cosmology.

So the only current official 3.5 campaign setting that uses the Great Wheel is Greyhawk.

This new 4th Ed cosmology is for the "Points of Light" implied setting – big deal.

 

[catsclaw227]

The standard D&D cosmology. You know, as presented in the core D&D rules for the last thirty years? As the standard? Trying to pretend that it's "just another cosmology" like those presented in third-party products or one campaign setting is disingenuous, and you know that — or at least you should.

And yes, Necromancer Games will take the corpse of the Elemental Planes and work their magic on them, keeping them ambulatory, but they'll still be dead, cut off from the lifegiving force of being an official, supported, D&D product.

I am not being disingenuous. The "standard D&D cosmology" as you describe is a Greyhawk thing, and if I am not mistaken wasn't really described in any significant detail until Planescapes 2e On Hallowed Ground and expanded upon in the Manual of the Planes. We never used that cosmology. Acutally, we used the Newhon and Melnibonean cosmologys from my 1980 1st printing of Deities and Demigods. I can show it to you, if you like. In my campaign, elementals were spirits from the Prime. The Deities & Demigods book was an update to the 1976 Supplement IV, Gods, Demi-gods & Heroes from OD&D.

So, no. I am not being disengenuous. I have been playing D&D since 1976, and have played all editions. I didn't start using the "implied" cosmology of the Great Wheel until I DMed a Planescape campaign back in 2e. Even then, we didn't use it for our standard homebrew D&D games.

 

[mhacdebhandia]

I am not being disingenuous. The "standard D&D cosmology" as you describe is a Greyhawk thing, and if I am not mistaken wasn't really described in any significant detail until Planescapes 2e On Hallowed Ground and expanded upon in the Manual of the Planes.

You're right that it's a Greyhawk thing, but it was first described in the First Edition Manual of the Planes and fleshed-out in the Second Edition Planescape Campaign Setting boxed set.

On Hallowed Ground was a Planescape setting supplement specifically about deities, their realms, and their servants.