Elephant in the room: rogue and fighter dailies.

[mlund]

The Fighter gets Action Points. Good for him.

The Hafling has "Lucky" as a racial perk. Good for him.

The Thief gets a "Knack" at level 2 where he gets advantage on a get - basically a limited luck mechanic. Good for him.

Characters in most editions have had daily perks to tap into - even non-magical ones. The big cry-fest over 4th Edition was the idea that Martial characters had Daily Attacks - martial maneuvers they somehow "forgot" how to do for a whole day after they burned them.

- Marty Lund

 

[Savage Wombat]

What is this talk about elephants? I didn't find them in the playtest bestiary...

 

[Warbringer]

Always just figured the PC was always looking for the opportunity and trying his luck... The Player just happens to decide the time the PC pulls it off, rather than a 5% for "daily" or a 15% for an " encounter" to use 4e parlance

 

[Minigiant]

I think there is no outcry because Fighter's Surge, Knack, and lucky don't provide result that can't be reproduced mundanely.

It is just another attack or a bonus to an attack or skill. It is not causing blindness or tripping.


Surge lets you do something you can do already again for no action cost. It isn't doubling your damage roll or pushing your opponent back 10 ft.

Not like I had an issue with 4E martial powers either.

I always assumed that a 4e character was always trying for dailies and the player decided when it would work and not coke out as an atwill or encounter attack.

 

[dkyle]

I think there is no outcry because Fighter's Surge, Knack, and lucky don't provide result that can't be reproduced mundanely.

It is just another attack or a bonus to an attack or skill. It is not causing blindness or tripping.

I'm pretty sure it's possible, in the real world, to blind or trip someone without using magic...

 

[grimslade]

I'm pretty sure it's possible, in the real world, to blind or trip someone without using magic...

It's not that it's magic. The complaint is why would you only get to trip a person 1/day because you use the Trippin' Your Face Off Daily power? Fighters being able to reproduce their attacks more frequently in previous editions.

 

[ThirdWizard]

Dissociated mechanics! Nooooooo!!!!

We should totally do that thread again.

 

[slobster]

What is this talk about elephants? I didn't find them in the playtest bestiary...

Are you drunk? You may have rolled poorly on your search because you're disadvantaged.

 

[Mengu]

Here is what I think, 4e had it right. Unless you have encounter powers, these daily resources are going to get used up in the first fight (because players don't have anything more interesting to do), and then they are going to want an extended rest, resulting in the 5 minute adventuring day, yet again.

The way I'm reading it, the fighter can make two attacks in the first two rounds of combat. After that, he's too tired to fight that way the rest of the day.

With the short rest mechanics the way they are, you really don't want to take damage. The best way to not take damage, in the case of the fighter, is to kill the first enemy as quickly as possible with multiple attacks. In the case of the halfling, it is to reroll your first and second miss. In 4e terms, the 5e adventuring day is one big encounter, and these abilities are your "nova" abilities that you would want to use as early and as often as possible.

 

[Kinak]

I'm not a fan of 4e and fighter dailies annoyed me, but not because they were fighter dailies. Wizard at-wills annoyed people too, even though I like them in practice.

My problem with it wasn't that there were fighter dailies. They were just a symbol of the classes all being forced to use the same power structure.

Before then, you could pick and choose which power structure you wanted. All at-wills? Play a fighter or rogue. Vancian casting? Play a wizard or cleric. Spontaneous casting? Sorcerer. Mana casting? Psionicist. Rounds per day? Barbarian. Daily abilities? Monk.

At least one of my players won't play each of those, but there are plenty of other options. It's like a buffet. At launch, 4e said "you'll eat this and like it!"

And if you didn't like it, the only option was not playing 4e. So everyone who liked the all at-wills fighter and didn't like 4e's unified power system was angry about fighter dailies. Same with those who liked Vancian casting and wizard/cleric at-wills.

So, I can certainly see your cause for alarm, but as long as they keep a wide range of character options and complexity levels, I'm good to go.

Cheers!
Kinak