D&D 4E Eliminating magic items in 4e completely

[Klaus]

The recent Design & Development talked about you're expected to have a +2 implemenet/armor/cloak by 9th level. That means the math of the game (Defenses/AC/attacks of foes) already have that factored in.

So just include the supposed bonus into the characters and you don't need any of those items at all. At 4th level (and every 4 levels thereafter), each PC gets a +1 bonus to attack, AC and Defenses (+2 at 8th, +3 at 12th, +4 at 16th, +5 at 20th, +6 at 24th and +7 at 28th). Presto! The math is factored in and you don't need an outside source for them (namely, items), allowing the DM to not include such items in his game.

 

[Plane Sailing]

I don't think the issue is the bonuses which you'd get in your attacks and saves.

I think the issue with eliminating magic items would be how do you allow for the vastly different capabilities which an arcane or divine caster has over a martial type without allowing for magic items for divination, travel and so forth?

In other words, I think that your best chance of success for a successful game where magic items are eliminated is to also eliminate the arcane and divine power sources. End up with martial heroes coming up with martial solutions to problems.

I'd imagine that as you move into paragon and epic tiers this might prove more difficult to maintain, but it could be possible.

Cheers

 

[Anthtriel]

Has been done before.

Mearls said that factoring magic items out will be fast and easy, as compared to 3E, where it took quite a bit of times and rules (as the creator of Iron Heroes, he has credibility here).

Still, I'm not entirely convinced. Can the secondary item effects really be weak enough not to factor into balance, but exciting enough to be worth having?
Hitting and getting hit will work as it should, but the character without magical items will probably deal less damage (weaker crits, no weapon properties), have no damage resistances, and none of the various quirky effects that items will probably give, i.e. no increased speed from boots and the like.

I'm sure items will not be as important as in 3E, where you cannot hit anything, and are hit by everything if you have no items. But I don't believe you can just replace them with straight up boni and come up with the same difficulty for encounters. How much harder players with stingy DMs will have it has yet to be seen.

 

[Goblyn]

I don't think the issue is the bonuses which you'd get in your attacks and saves.

I think the issue with eliminating magic items would be how do you allow for the vastly different capabilities which an arcane or divine caster has over a martial type without allowing for magic items for divination, travel and so forth?
<snip>

Cheers

Well, it seems like in 4e the capabilities of different classes(arcane/divine/martial) aren't going to be so hugely disparate as in 3.x, so, depending on how it turns out, this may even be a non-issue. As always, we have to wait and see. Curses!

 

[Klaus]

I don't think the issue is the bonuses which you'd get in your attacks and saves.

I think the issue with eliminating magic items would be how do you allow for the vastly different capabilities which an arcane or divine caster has over a martial type without allowing for magic items for divination, travel and so forth?

In other words, I think that your best chance of success for a successful game where magic items are eliminated is to also eliminate the arcane and divine power sources. End up with martial heroes coming up with martial solutions to problems.

I'd imagine that as you move into paragon and epic tiers this might prove more difficult to maintain, but it could be possible.

Cheers

Judging by the article, those secondary items are completely unnecessary to the game, just interesting options.

So you could have a character with no items except for a One Ring, or a Palantír, or a Bow of Energy Arrows Who Does Pretty Much Anything You Can Imagine If The Cartoon Writers Are Willing.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

How can a fighter ever be able to fly without magical means? That is just not possible.

 

[arscott]

But is it strictly necessary that a fighter be able to fly? Can't he have other, less magical powers that are different from flying but still provide equivalent advantages to those provided by flying?

 

[StarFyre]

issue i see

The issue i see, a fantasy game, people (me included) would want the possibility of doing truly fantastic things. Otherwise I'd DM D20 modern or something Such fantastic things just ain't happening without magic, artifacts, magic items, etc.

Sanjay

 

[orc food]

The recent Design & Development talked about you're expected to have a +2 implemenet/armor/cloak by 9th level. That means the math of the game (Defenses/AC/attacks of foes) already have that factored in.

So just include the supposed bonus into the characters and you don't need any of those items at all. At 4th level (and every 4 levels thereafter), each PC gets a +1 bonus to attack, AC and Defenses (+2 at 8th, +3 at 12th, +4 at 16th, +5 at 20th, +6 at 24th and +7 at 28th). Presto! The math is factored in and you don't need an outside source for them (namely, items), allowing the DM to not include such items in his game.

Problems with removing magic items.
1.) I have played games (like 20 in the past 15 years) where few to none magic items were ever given out. You as sure could not buy them. What happen,
a.) Money became useless, and players had a LOT of it. Player would go in and buy whole towns! Some made gold houses for themselves. You have to have something to buy or add the painful online thing where you have to pay to fix your items to keep money useful in the game.
b.) Everyone became a spell caster of some kind. Funny how many NPC's become spell casters too. So low magic means little. Just the melee builds getting cut out of the game.

2.) magic items are part of the wonder. The problem with D&D, Magic items are a must have to be useful needful things. You do not get items for the "cool", you get them as you need them to live though combat. The 4th ed is not changing this.

3.) I hope 4th can be more low magic. In any 3th ed game that allowed spell caster, Low magic settings became a pain to play outside of playing a wizard/cleric. No spell casters and Player death became a lot more common.

 

[Wolfspider]

How can a fighter ever be able to fly without magical means? That is just not possible.

Hey, this is D&D 4e we're talking about here.

You will believe a fighter can fly.