Encompassing Asian Elements in a setting

[Remathilis]

Ok, this idea is partially inspired by long hours of both Soul Calibur and Final Fantasy...

Building a setting from the ground up, what are some good ways to incorporate asian elements into a traditional D&D setting. By "asian" I mean ninja's samurai and katanas. By traditional D&D, I'm talking the default PH/DMG/MM scenario.

Samurai and paladins lock blades. Ninja's sneak into a wizards laboratory. Monks stare down barbarian hordes. It has so much potential, but I'm at a loss as to how to do it and keep some level of continuity. Is there a way to have these traditionally eastern elements in the more western-based game? I think it can be done, but I'm at a loss as to how to start.

Suggestions?

 

[mhacdebhandia]

First, consider that there's nothing which prevents a "western Europe"-style setting from being invaded by armies from "Asia", or vice-versa.

In reality, the Near East and the Middle East and a whole big stretch of Russia and former Soviet republics separates western Europe from China, Japan, et aliis.

In any given homebrewed D&D setting, this need not be true. You could have large areas controlled by "Europeans" who invaded "Asia" generations ago and stuck around, and vice-versa. Think of the fact that Islamic emirs and caliphs controlled Spain for quite a while - parts of the Iberian peninsula were under Islamic rule for nearly eight hundred years (711-1492). Situate your campaign on the border between a "European France" and an "Asian Spain" and Bob's your uncle.

 

[Glyfair]

First, consider that there's nothing which prevents a "western Europe"-style setting from being invaded by armies from "Asia", or vice-versa.

There is also nothing that says that the "Asian elements" have to be "Asian" in a setting. Keith Baker has suggested that a lot of the Oriental Adventures oriented classes would be appropriate for the hobgoblin/goblin culture in Eberron (specifically the Ninja and Samurai).

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

Don't worry about it?

Seriously, I wouldn't try to justify it.

If, for some reason, you want to justify it, just mix it up. Samurai are special retainers of the nobility, and ninja are sneaky assassins and infiltrators who work for their clans/guilds. You don't have to have them be Asian in origin at all.

Brad

 

[mhacdebhandia]

There is also nothing that says that the "Asian elements" have to be "Asian" in a setting. Keith Baker has suggested that a lot of the Oriental Adventures oriented classes would be appropriate for the hobgoblin/goblin culture in Eberron (specifically the Ninja and Samurai).

Absolutely, I've read his comments on those lines myself.

For your average D&D game (and gamer?), though, they're going to expect Asian samurai.

 

[EdL]

There is very little difference, in theory, between a knight and a samurai. They are both feudal warrior vassels of an overlord, sometimes with land and/or vassels of their own, and sometimes not.

Ninja aren't Asian, they are very specifically Japanese. (Well, so are samurai.) However, there was no reason in the real world that Japanese envoys, complete with both, couldn't have gone to europe. So there's no reason they can't show up in your world. One good shipwreck or bandit raid and they could find themselves on their own. With no lord to follow or give them orders, adventuring to get the money to go back home would be a good way to have them join a group. Or, if you want to use them as adversaries, just have the BBEG take them on as vassels of his own.

 

[Remathilis]

Thanks for the ideas so far...

granted: my discussion of "asian" tended to be Japanese stereotypical, but there are plenty of other asian elements worthy of inclusion.

Aside from the "asian invasion" idea, is there a way that these elements could have come about naturally, ie the traditions grew up alongside the druids and paladins of D&D. A couple of my own thoughs:

1.) An insular kingdom has developed these traditions and recently opened its borders...

2.) A specific race (elves, goblins, etc) invented some/all of these and they are now spreading to other races...

3.) There isn't nothing special about a samurai; he's just a warrior with a different training and no more culturally unique than a fighter and a paladin. Or at least no stranger than a monk...

Basically, I'm having an arguement with my inner history professor; making it make sense JUST enough to explain to someone why two historically different cultures are blended as so...

btw: I really like mhacdebhandia's muslim spain idea... something to look into. I haven't QUITE yet ruled out the "mythic earth" scenario either, all myth exists simultaneously as needed (think Hercules: Legendary Journey and your 3/4 of the way there...)

 

[Stormborn]

Well, if you want the various "Oriental Adventures"-style classes to exist along side the standard PHB ones try going a different route, although somewhat similar to your 3) above. Rather than make a big deal about an isolated country, a recent invasion, etc, try simple regional or relgious variations. One pantheon of Gods, a particularly martial one, is served by Clerics and Paladins, where as in another land the gods are more elemental in nature and are the domain of Shugenja and Monks. Meanwhile that land develops the Samuri and Ninja tradition as a deliberate counter to the elite Paladins of their enemies. Magical study develops along different lines, in one place Wizards and in another Wujen. These are two civilized lands, with multiple nations in each, that while perhaps seperates by a mountain range or small sea, are completly aware of one another and have been trading for as long as anyone can rememeber. Both are plagued by rogues of various caliburs and inclinations while bards passing between them in a vast network of information and trade.

Meanwhile outside these lands are the Barbarian hordes with their Druids or Spirit Shaman. Rangers, who have picked up little bits of the Barbarians' ways live on the edge of civilization, part of neither civilization or the wilds.


If you are building a world from the ground up, its easy to make plausible the existance of more "asian" classes.

 

[tensen]

In my own experience it is easiest to introduce one of the races as following the culture.
For instance in our Gnomes product we made a Korean based version of Gnomes for such a purpose. The idea is that it exists within their culture, which may be right on the edge or even within the standard Euopean human culture. But since it is a different race, and not humans, folks don't pay much attention to it... except when dealing directly with that race.

 

[mhacdebhandia]

btw: I really like mhacdebhandia's muslim spain idea... something to look into.

I'm quite fond of it myself - I've been thinking about the region as a possible model for part of the campaign setting I'm working on now.

After a few hundred years, the "invaders" would seem both familiar and exotic. You could therefore have your Oriental Adventures aspects be a long-standing and widely-accepted feature of the campaign world while still maintaining the cultural divisions between the "Asians" and the "Europeans".