ENnies V - and beyond...

[Psion]

Well most times the products you favour or disfavour are for a reason. There is a reason for giving a product a low vote, and the ideology of the company that produces that product could certainly be a part of it.

I think saying "most times" is a wild stab at best, optimistic at worst.

The concern is many times (I won't pretend to know how many) you sacrifice titles you aren't familiar with to the slaughter to boost the chances for your own favored title. That is not, IMO, a good "reason".

 

[Crothian]

Well most times the products you favour or disfavour are for a reason. There is a reason for giving a product a low vote, and the ideology of the company that produces that product could certainly be a part of it.

That's really not what worries me. What worries me is the people who vote low for products that have no info on just so the one product in the category they know of wins. Can people truly pick the best product out of five if they've only read two or three of them? We switched from selecting the best to rating them all because people complained because they weren't familiar with all the nominations as well allowing the little companies to actually stand a chance.

 

[Old Fezziwig]

Thanks, Conaill. That's interesting stuff, and it makes sense.

Best,
Nick

 

[Nisarg]

I think saying "most times" is a wild stab at best, optimistic at worst.

The concern is many times (I won't pretend to know how many) you sacrifice titles you aren't familiar with to the slaughter to boost the chances for your own favored title. That is not, IMO, a good "reason".

Ah yes.. well that is a different story. But again, while considerably less "fair" a thing to do, its technically not against the rules, until the judges change the voting system to make it impossible to do this.

Personally, I always make use of the "i don't know this product" feature when its a product I genuinely know nothing about.

Nisarg

 

[Staffan]

Exactly. The awards are sponsored by ENWorld, and the judges should come from ENWorld as well. We are the ones putting up the cash (or more precisely, Russ is putting up the cash) to put the awards together. We are the ones who do all the work. If anything, maybe 1 outside judge, but by no means will we be giving up a majority (3? That's never going to happen) to outside judges.

Note that Russ has stated that from next year on, the ENnies are going to have to pay for themselves, one way or another - money from the site are not going to go to support the awards. So that's a moot point.

 

[Lela]

That's really not what worries me. What worries me is the people who vote low for products that have no info on just so the one product in the category they know of wins. Can people truly pick the best product out of five if they've only read two or three of them? We switched from selecting the best to rating them all because people complained because they weren't familiar with all the nominations as well allowing the little companies to actually stand a chance.

Does this system really change that? They still don't have all 5 books. They still can vote low on one they haven't heard of, hoping the one they have wins.

It also occurs to me that market presence needs to be somewhat of a factor, seeing as they are supposed to be an award from the masses. If more masses like a product, that product should do better than one with less masses liking it. Harsh, from the perspective of smaller companies, I realize. Not quite as harsh from the perspective of the masses hoping for their mass to have a massive impact.*

It does occur to me that we choose the judges using a favor vote. The argument could be made that voters aren't choosing the best judges because those judges don't have as big a market presence on the board. They don't know who Teflon Billy is and therefor don't vote for him, regardless of how good he is.

*Sorry. I got carried away.

 

[Crothian]

Well, actually no one really knows just who Teflon Billy is, he's like the Shadow in that way

The system we have is not perfect, but it does at least allow for the choice of "I don't know this product".

 

[Teflon Billy]

They don't know who Teflon Billy is and therefor don't vote for him, regardless of how good he is...

That's crazy talk; everyone votes for me

 

[Lela]

Well, actually no one really knows just who Teflon Billy is, he's like the Shadow in that way

Well, now that The Shadow has retired, I guess someone has to take over.

The system we have is not perfect, but it does at least allow for the choice of "I don't know this product".

Of course not, we'll never have a "Perfect" system. That, however, doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for it.

Someone's definitally going to get the short end of the stick here, it's just a question of who. I'd rather err on the side of masses. Others would rather err on the side of small business. Both are valid.

The only other option I can think of is having the judges go so far as to choose the winner entirely on their own, much like the Acadamy Awards. Naturally, no one actually wants to do this; me included.

 

[Crothian]

The only other option I can think of is having the judges go so far as to choose the winner entirely on their own, much like the Acadamy Awards. Naturally, no one actually wants to do this; me included.

I wouldn't say nobody. There was a good suggest that instead of Gold and Silver we have a Judge's and Fan's Award. I thought that was a good suggestion that might deserve some exploration.