Night Watchman
First Post
Wow, I'm going to have to go through these a bit closer but these flavor rules you have look very cool Gunpowder_Treasoner. Very cool
EoM: Rev and EoM: ME revisited
- Thread starter ruleslawyer
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Gunpowder_Treasoner
First Post
Thanks. I wanted to deviate from the fairy centered theme of ME to a darker setting that exhalts magi as in Ars Magica, a truly inventive game that's rules makes my poor little brain hurt so very much. I might post up my campaign idea a bit later is I ever find the time.
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ruleslawyer
Registered User
G_T:
SO sorry I haven't been checking in here; I completely forgot that this thread wasn't on the General boards!
This looks fabulous!
I have a roughly similar casting method going, but I use stress and strain, which are roughly similar to your flux.
First comments:
A) Your renamings are excellent! I may have to thieve these if it's all right...
B) I'd suggest keeping the mechanics for components under the same umbrella, as it were. Why not have the caster just gain 1 flux on a failed Will save if he casts without a component?
C) The Methuselah template is awesome! Lots of flavor and few enough mechanical benefits that I don't see the problem applying it in general.
D) The War Wizard seems balanced, assuming that "Harrowing Lore" is the same as "Attack" (see below). I've tended to note that the Enhanced Damage and Enhanced Attack applications are generally better than direct damage anyway, so I don't see a problem here.
E) Okay, I know that no mage should be accumulating 10 or more flux points, but permanent loss of spellcasting ability just rubs me the wrong way, especially since you probably don't have an equivalent to wish, miracle, or divine intervention in your campaign. Maybe a permanent -x to all spellcasting checks instead?
Some questions:
1) I'm going to guess that "Harrowing Lore" is the new name for "Attack," but I'd like to be sure. Could you clarify?
2) What did you rename your other magic skills? For what reasons?
In general, though, this looks great!
SO sorry I haven't been checking in here; I completely forgot that this thread wasn't on the General boards!
This looks fabulous!
I have a roughly similar casting method going, but I use stress and strain, which are roughly similar to your flux.
First comments:
A) Your renamings are excellent! I may have to thieve these if it's all right...
B) I'd suggest keeping the mechanics for components under the same umbrella, as it were. Why not have the caster just gain 1 flux on a failed Will save if he casts without a component?
C) The Methuselah template is awesome! Lots of flavor and few enough mechanical benefits that I don't see the problem applying it in general.
D) The War Wizard seems balanced, assuming that "Harrowing Lore" is the same as "Attack" (see below). I've tended to note that the Enhanced Damage and Enhanced Attack applications are generally better than direct damage anyway, so I don't see a problem here.
E) Okay, I know that no mage should be accumulating 10 or more flux points, but permanent loss of spellcasting ability just rubs me the wrong way, especially since you probably don't have an equivalent to wish, miracle, or divine intervention in your campaign. Maybe a permanent -x to all spellcasting checks instead?
Some questions:
1) I'm going to guess that "Harrowing Lore" is the new name for "Attack," but I'd like to be sure. Could you clarify?
2) What did you rename your other magic skills? For what reasons?
In general, though, this looks great!
Gunpowder_Treasoner
First Post
Thieve all ya want 
I changed the magical skill names for two reasons: 1.) to add some flavor to the system and 2.) make the skills more suited to my particular mythos. The originals were just too generic, though I'm assuming it was made so that DMs could seamlessly adapt the system to their needs. Here's what I've named the skills (referred to as "Lores" in my setting by the mage crowd, again for flavor) after the latest overhaul of my mechanics:
Attack: Scourging (formerly Harrowing; sorry, I forgot to change the name when I posted up "War Wizardry," which I renamed "Scourge")
Charm: Ruling
Create: Making (metacreation)
Cure: Weaving
Defend: Warding
Divine: Seeking
Illusion: Seeming
Move: Quickening
Summon: Making (conjuration)
Transform: Shaping
The only other changes I've made to my system since my last post is re-naming "Mana" to "Aether," as the former is too generic and bland for me, in addition to conflicting with my revised explination for where magic comes from. And, the Saving Throw DC is now Equal to 10 + 1/2 the spell's level + the mages Wisdom modifier; i realized that min/maxers will naturally make Intelligence their dump stat to ensure maximum skill points (the mage is free to choose any of the 3 mental ability scores to determine how much bonus aether and evocations he may have). I lumped Summon in with Create as it's my opinion that it's just too limited to be it's own skill (mages get both metacreation and conjuration when they take Making as a class skill, though diffrent traditions offer diffrent bonuses to each sub-skill). I think I'll have the mages gain a point of flux for casting without a focus, though I'm keeping the rule that lets mages choose what component they want for their spells (after all, I have to have some reason why wizards haul around wands, staves, and talismans everywhere they go). I know my 10 point Flux rule is brutal, and it's highly unlikely that any mage will ever acquire it; it's more of an omnious warning to all mages that they should NEVER attempt to summon forces they can't control. A less brutal alternative would be a permanat -2 penalty (removable only by a powerful incantation equlivent to wish) to spellcasting checks if you're uncomfortable with the loss of spellcasting ability.
I made the War Wizard/Scourge tradition solely for the purpose of sating my lust for explosions and slinging around lightning bolts, and to have a Attack/Scourging focused tradition other than Wuxia Sorcery (which I've called Battlemage until I can think of a better name). I'm glad you like the Methuselah template; wizards are my favorite characters of all time, and have been shorthanded far too many times in literature for my tastes. I'll post up more if you're interested.
I changed the magical skill names for two reasons: 1.) to add some flavor to the system and 2.) make the skills more suited to my particular mythos. The originals were just too generic, though I'm assuming it was made so that DMs could seamlessly adapt the system to their needs. Here's what I've named the skills (referred to as "Lores" in my setting by the mage crowd, again for flavor) after the latest overhaul of my mechanics:Attack: Scourging (formerly Harrowing; sorry, I forgot to change the name when I posted up "War Wizardry," which I renamed "Scourge")
Charm: Ruling
Create: Making (metacreation)
Cure: Weaving
Defend: Warding
Divine: Seeking
Illusion: Seeming
Move: Quickening
Summon: Making (conjuration)
Transform: Shaping
The only other changes I've made to my system since my last post is re-naming "Mana" to "Aether," as the former is too generic and bland for me, in addition to conflicting with my revised explination for where magic comes from. And, the Saving Throw DC is now Equal to 10 + 1/2 the spell's level + the mages Wisdom modifier; i realized that min/maxers will naturally make Intelligence their dump stat to ensure maximum skill points (the mage is free to choose any of the 3 mental ability scores to determine how much bonus aether and evocations he may have). I lumped Summon in with Create as it's my opinion that it's just too limited to be it's own skill (mages get both metacreation and conjuration when they take Making as a class skill, though diffrent traditions offer diffrent bonuses to each sub-skill). I think I'll have the mages gain a point of flux for casting without a focus, though I'm keeping the rule that lets mages choose what component they want for their spells (after all, I have to have some reason why wizards haul around wands, staves, and talismans everywhere they go). I know my 10 point Flux rule is brutal, and it's highly unlikely that any mage will ever acquire it; it's more of an omnious warning to all mages that they should NEVER attempt to summon forces they can't control. A less brutal alternative would be a permanat -2 penalty (removable only by a powerful incantation equlivent to wish) to spellcasting checks if you're uncomfortable with the loss of spellcasting ability.
I made the War Wizard/Scourge tradition solely for the purpose of sating my lust for explosions and slinging around lightning bolts, and to have a Attack/Scourging focused tradition other than Wuxia Sorcery (which I've called Battlemage until I can think of a better name). I'm glad you like the Methuselah template; wizards are my favorite characters of all time, and have been shorthanded far too many times in literature for my tastes. I'll post up more if you're interested.
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ruleslawyer
Registered User
Please do!Gunpowder_Treasoner said:
Gunpowder_Treasoner
First Post
M'kay, though be warned: this post turned out to be freakishly massive! I've decided to make Methuselah immune to all supernatural disease (lychanthropy, vampirism, mummoy rot, etc.) as well. Here's 4 new Traditions I've managed to draw up:
Goetia [Tradition]
You believe that by making pacts with demonic entities, you gain the power to make all your dark desires a reality.
Benefit: You gain the Lore Making, Ruling, Scourging, and Seeming as class skills, and receive a +2 bonus to Making (conjuration) spellcasting checks made to summon evil outsiders. Your Scourging spells deal death damage. Once per day, you may invoke an “Eldritch Rage,” gaining a +2 bonus to any Lore of your choice and a +1 bonus to your effective caster level for a number of rounds equal to half your caster level. This process is taxing however; you are fatigued at the end of the Rage, lose 1 aether, suffer a ravaging, and cannot recover lost hit points for a number of minutes equal to the spell’s level.
Rituals: You must pledge a favor to some evil entity. The extent of the favor depends on the level of the spell you cast, but limitations are very vague. If the entity calls upon the favor and you refuse, you will incite its enmity, and possibly its wrath.
Backlash: You become possessed by a demon for the spell’s intended duration, and the demon tries to cause as much suffering as it can.
Special: Needless to say, when you finally die, your demonic patron calls dibs on your soul…
Quantum Magic [Tradition]
You believe you posses the power to bend and twist time and space to your whim.
Prerequisite: Knowledge (physical science) 4 ranks
Benefit: You gain the Lore of Making, Quickening, and Seeking as class skills, and receive a +2 bonus to Quickening spellcasting checks. You choose two areas of Quantum Tunneling – flight, haste, incorporeality, or teleportation – as if you had taken the Movement Specialization feat.
Rituals: You must spend at least one minute inscribing elaborate mathematical theorems and equations to coordinate the energies you indent to summon, requiring a Knowledge (physical sciences) check equal to 5+ the spell’s level.
Backlash: ?
Scourge [Tradition]
You believe you have mastered the magics of destruction, and may lay waste to all that stands in your way.
Benefit: You gain the Lore of Scourging as a class skill and receive a +2 bonus to Scourging checks that do not have enhanced damage or enchant weapon enhancements. All of your Scourging spells that deal direct damage deal an extra +1d6 points of damage and benefit from a +1 bonus to the save DC. If you spend one full round focusing your power before casting your Scourging spell, the bonus increases by +1 for each round you do nothing but focus, to a maximum of +8.
Rituals: There are no rituals for this round.
Backlash: You suffer “spellburn,”and take lethal damage equal to the spell’s level.
Shapeshifter [Tradition]
You believe you possess the power to sculpt your body into whatever shape you desire.
Benefit: You gain the Lore of Shaping and Weaving as class skills, and receive a +2 bonus to Shaping and Weaving spellcasting checks that affect only you. As soon as you take this feat and at every three levels after, you may choose a Shaping evocation that affects only you to be your “co-essence,” allowing you to cast that evocation as a swift action.
Rituals: All those involved in the ritual must be pure of mind, effectively sublimating their egos to make the acceptance of change flow seamlessly. Those whose minds are not pure must make a Concentration check (DC 20) to keep a clear mind for the duration of the ritual.
Backlash: You fluctuate between different forms wildly, taking damage equal to the spell’s level and 2 points of Constitution damage.
...and this one by combing aspects of Freed Mind and Telepath:
Psychonaut [Tradition]
You believe you possess potent psychic powers that allow you to reshape reality with but a mere thought.
Benefit: You gain the Lore of Quickening, Ruling, Seeking, and Seeming class skills and receive a +2 bonus to Ruling spellcasting checks. While you are magically focused, you are always aware of any sentient minds within 30 ft. of you, even if you cannot see the creature. You gain no actual insight into the thoughts of that mind, nor of its location, merely that it is present.
Do you think Singing Blade could be modified for a modern setting if firearms could be used in addition to melee weapons?
And the changes I've made to existing Traditions:
I've removed Anime-ism, Squrilliomancy, Spanish Inquisitor, and Witchcraft traditions, while adding in Wild Spellcraft and Unity Song. Everything else I'ce left alone, save for a few name and flavor changes:
Elder Mysteries: Alienism
Christian Healer/Magus: I've combined these two Traditions into 1 simply labled "Theurgy," which may be based in any religion the player chooses.
Wuxia Sorcery/Norse Runecasting: combined into "War Mage," with the need for a bag of runes removed.
Wild Spellcraft: Chaos Magic
Classic Fey: Fey Witchcraft
Dreamtime: Shamanism
Blood Magic: Hemomancy
Kabbalistic Alchemy: Hermeticism
Stage Magic: Mesmerism
Psychic Sensetive: Oracle; I've remade this tradition into a "magic" one and not a "psychic" tradition, eliminating the need for magic focus to cast spells from this tradition.
Wicca: Paganism; a stretch I know, but I am trying to incoperate broad spectrum traditions to cover all the real life occult beliefs.
Refinements: Refinements are supernatural blessings that Mages bestow upon themselves by infusing their bodies with raw aether. The exact effects requires combat actions of varying lengths, and diffrent costs of aether depending on the task. The effects are as follows:
Regeneration (3 aether; Full round action): You instantly benefit from your “Rapid Metabolism.” Regardless of how much aether you spend, can benefit from only 3 uses of Rapid Metabolism per day.
Blood of the Sanctioned (2 aether; free action): Your blood becomes infused with raging aether, making it toxic to any creature that dares sink it’s fangs into your flesh. For a number of rounds equal to half your caster level (rounded down), any creature that makes a bite attack against you suffers 2d4 points of damage.
Purify Numina (2 aether; standard action): You may remove a single point of Flux
Supernatiral Grace (2 aether; free action): You receive a +4 racial bonus to any save until the beginning of your next turn or you may choose to add a +4 insight bonus to defense for one round.
Repletion (1 aether; standard action): You may go 24 hours without food or water.
Flare (1 ather; standard action): By taking 5 points of non-lethal damage, you receive a +1 bonus to all spellcasting checks for a number of rounds equal to half your caster level. By taking 2 point of Constitution damage, the bonus increases to +2. The bonuses (and health sacrifices) are doubled for each additional point of aether you spend.
I've also re-worked the source of magic, as I just plain don't like the idea of mages having to bond themselves to an outside entity for power, favoring a inner wellspring of power that is theirs and theirs alone. Their Numina, and the aether it produces, is the source of their power, and requires only that the mage undergo the Revelation (a ritual preformed by another that awakens the Numina within the soul of the one deemed worthy enough to enter the ranks of the Methuselah) or that they be a descentent of a member of the ancient Kingdoms Of Sorcery (the Hyperborean Empire, the Free Peoples of Mu, and the Atlantean Theocracy) to become active.
I'll keep my explination of how magic works brief and too the point: throughout everything in the Universe flows mana, an impersonal force that constitutes the divine, spiritual aspect of Creation. Beings that harbor aether, purified mana that is formed only in leylines and the Numina of mortal souls, can reach out and manipulate the unseen currents of mana in various capacities and techniques, refered to as the Lores of Nine. At the height of the Kingdoms of Sorcery, mages had absolute control over magic, and could reshape reality with but a thought. Since the Kingdom's fall, mages now must impliment a mix of belief, magical tools, and sheer willpower (represented in game terms by the Tradition feats and spell components). As some of the secrets of the Kingdoms of Sorcery managed to survive it's cataclysmic collapse, mages in my setting have a keener understanding of magic, and as such, the base spellcasting DC is equal to 8 + the spell's level.
The campaign premise I have is the goodly wizards of the Tetragrammaton orgnization and their motely allies (various alien species such as the Fraal and the Great Race of Yith, benevolent faries, mortals aware of the supernatural, reformed vampires and werewolves) protect the people of earth, blinded to the supernatural by a mix of the Twilight (I'll explain later, posted too much already) and Disbelief (please note that disbelief in no way affects how magic works, only how it is percieved; I do not approve of mages having to suffer for the ignorance of man, and NOTHING is gonna change that view any time soon), from nightmarish horrors spoken of in the tales of Lovecraft, scheming demons, psychotic warlocks (evil wizards corrupted by their own power), the living dead, savage monsters left from ages past, and the ever warring Fae. How does all that sound?
Goetia [Tradition]
You believe that by making pacts with demonic entities, you gain the power to make all your dark desires a reality.
Benefit: You gain the Lore Making, Ruling, Scourging, and Seeming as class skills, and receive a +2 bonus to Making (conjuration) spellcasting checks made to summon evil outsiders. Your Scourging spells deal death damage. Once per day, you may invoke an “Eldritch Rage,” gaining a +2 bonus to any Lore of your choice and a +1 bonus to your effective caster level for a number of rounds equal to half your caster level. This process is taxing however; you are fatigued at the end of the Rage, lose 1 aether, suffer a ravaging, and cannot recover lost hit points for a number of minutes equal to the spell’s level.
Rituals: You must pledge a favor to some evil entity. The extent of the favor depends on the level of the spell you cast, but limitations are very vague. If the entity calls upon the favor and you refuse, you will incite its enmity, and possibly its wrath.
Backlash: You become possessed by a demon for the spell’s intended duration, and the demon tries to cause as much suffering as it can.
Special: Needless to say, when you finally die, your demonic patron calls dibs on your soul…
Quantum Magic [Tradition]
You believe you posses the power to bend and twist time and space to your whim.
Prerequisite: Knowledge (physical science) 4 ranks
Benefit: You gain the Lore of Making, Quickening, and Seeking as class skills, and receive a +2 bonus to Quickening spellcasting checks. You choose two areas of Quantum Tunneling – flight, haste, incorporeality, or teleportation – as if you had taken the Movement Specialization feat.
Rituals: You must spend at least one minute inscribing elaborate mathematical theorems and equations to coordinate the energies you indent to summon, requiring a Knowledge (physical sciences) check equal to 5+ the spell’s level.
Backlash: ?
Scourge [Tradition]
You believe you have mastered the magics of destruction, and may lay waste to all that stands in your way.
Benefit: You gain the Lore of Scourging as a class skill and receive a +2 bonus to Scourging checks that do not have enhanced damage or enchant weapon enhancements. All of your Scourging spells that deal direct damage deal an extra +1d6 points of damage and benefit from a +1 bonus to the save DC. If you spend one full round focusing your power before casting your Scourging spell, the bonus increases by +1 for each round you do nothing but focus, to a maximum of +8.
Rituals: There are no rituals for this round.
Backlash: You suffer “spellburn,”and take lethal damage equal to the spell’s level.
Shapeshifter [Tradition]
You believe you possess the power to sculpt your body into whatever shape you desire.
Benefit: You gain the Lore of Shaping and Weaving as class skills, and receive a +2 bonus to Shaping and Weaving spellcasting checks that affect only you. As soon as you take this feat and at every three levels after, you may choose a Shaping evocation that affects only you to be your “co-essence,” allowing you to cast that evocation as a swift action.
Rituals: All those involved in the ritual must be pure of mind, effectively sublimating their egos to make the acceptance of change flow seamlessly. Those whose minds are not pure must make a Concentration check (DC 20) to keep a clear mind for the duration of the ritual.
Backlash: You fluctuate between different forms wildly, taking damage equal to the spell’s level and 2 points of Constitution damage.
...and this one by combing aspects of Freed Mind and Telepath:
Psychonaut [Tradition]
You believe you possess potent psychic powers that allow you to reshape reality with but a mere thought.
Benefit: You gain the Lore of Quickening, Ruling, Seeking, and Seeming class skills and receive a +2 bonus to Ruling spellcasting checks. While you are magically focused, you are always aware of any sentient minds within 30 ft. of you, even if you cannot see the creature. You gain no actual insight into the thoughts of that mind, nor of its location, merely that it is present.
Do you think Singing Blade could be modified for a modern setting if firearms could be used in addition to melee weapons?
And the changes I've made to existing Traditions:
I've removed Anime-ism, Squrilliomancy, Spanish Inquisitor, and Witchcraft traditions, while adding in Wild Spellcraft and Unity Song. Everything else I'ce left alone, save for a few name and flavor changes:
Elder Mysteries: Alienism
Christian Healer/Magus: I've combined these two Traditions into 1 simply labled "Theurgy," which may be based in any religion the player chooses.
Wuxia Sorcery/Norse Runecasting: combined into "War Mage," with the need for a bag of runes removed.
Wild Spellcraft: Chaos Magic
Classic Fey: Fey Witchcraft
Dreamtime: Shamanism
Blood Magic: Hemomancy
Kabbalistic Alchemy: Hermeticism
Stage Magic: Mesmerism
Psychic Sensetive: Oracle; I've remade this tradition into a "magic" one and not a "psychic" tradition, eliminating the need for magic focus to cast spells from this tradition.
Wicca: Paganism; a stretch I know, but I am trying to incoperate broad spectrum traditions to cover all the real life occult beliefs.
Refinements: Refinements are supernatural blessings that Mages bestow upon themselves by infusing their bodies with raw aether. The exact effects requires combat actions of varying lengths, and diffrent costs of aether depending on the task. The effects are as follows:
Regeneration (3 aether; Full round action): You instantly benefit from your “Rapid Metabolism.” Regardless of how much aether you spend, can benefit from only 3 uses of Rapid Metabolism per day.
Blood of the Sanctioned (2 aether; free action): Your blood becomes infused with raging aether, making it toxic to any creature that dares sink it’s fangs into your flesh. For a number of rounds equal to half your caster level (rounded down), any creature that makes a bite attack against you suffers 2d4 points of damage.
Purify Numina (2 aether; standard action): You may remove a single point of Flux
Supernatiral Grace (2 aether; free action): You receive a +4 racial bonus to any save until the beginning of your next turn or you may choose to add a +4 insight bonus to defense for one round.
Repletion (1 aether; standard action): You may go 24 hours without food or water.
Flare (1 ather; standard action): By taking 5 points of non-lethal damage, you receive a +1 bonus to all spellcasting checks for a number of rounds equal to half your caster level. By taking 2 point of Constitution damage, the bonus increases to +2. The bonuses (and health sacrifices) are doubled for each additional point of aether you spend.
I've also re-worked the source of magic, as I just plain don't like the idea of mages having to bond themselves to an outside entity for power, favoring a inner wellspring of power that is theirs and theirs alone. Their Numina, and the aether it produces, is the source of their power, and requires only that the mage undergo the Revelation (a ritual preformed by another that awakens the Numina within the soul of the one deemed worthy enough to enter the ranks of the Methuselah) or that they be a descentent of a member of the ancient Kingdoms Of Sorcery (the Hyperborean Empire, the Free Peoples of Mu, and the Atlantean Theocracy) to become active.
I'll keep my explination of how magic works brief and too the point: throughout everything in the Universe flows mana, an impersonal force that constitutes the divine, spiritual aspect of Creation. Beings that harbor aether, purified mana that is formed only in leylines and the Numina of mortal souls, can reach out and manipulate the unseen currents of mana in various capacities and techniques, refered to as the Lores of Nine. At the height of the Kingdoms of Sorcery, mages had absolute control over magic, and could reshape reality with but a thought. Since the Kingdom's fall, mages now must impliment a mix of belief, magical tools, and sheer willpower (represented in game terms by the Tradition feats and spell components). As some of the secrets of the Kingdoms of Sorcery managed to survive it's cataclysmic collapse, mages in my setting have a keener understanding of magic, and as such, the base spellcasting DC is equal to 8 + the spell's level.
The campaign premise I have is the goodly wizards of the Tetragrammaton orgnization and their motely allies (various alien species such as the Fraal and the Great Race of Yith, benevolent faries, mortals aware of the supernatural, reformed vampires and werewolves) protect the people of earth, blinded to the supernatural by a mix of the Twilight (I'll explain later, posted too much already) and Disbelief (please note that disbelief in no way affects how magic works, only how it is percieved; I do not approve of mages having to suffer for the ignorance of man, and NOTHING is gonna change that view any time soon
), from nightmarish horrors spoken of in the tales of Lovecraft, scheming demons, psychotic warlocks (evil wizards corrupted by their own power), the living dead, savage monsters left from ages past, and the ever warring Fae. How does all that sound?
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Primitive Screwhead
First Post
Hm.. Not my usual forum but I noticed the thread title 
EoM gets more coverage in the Enworld Publishing forum for some strange reason. RW tends to respond over there pretty quick.
I know he is looking at a EoM Third edition that melds EoM Revised and EoM ME, taking the best of the systems.
And, since I don't run EoM: ME.. I can't really be constructive about the above concepts.. but they do look like good ideas!
EoM gets more coverage in the Enworld Publishing forum for some strange reason. RW tends to respond over there pretty quick.
I know he is looking at a EoM Third edition that melds EoM Revised and EoM ME, taking the best of the systems.
And, since I don't run EoM: ME.. I can't really be constructive about the above concepts.. but they do look like good ideas!
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