Epic game: The Eye of Profane Truth (Full)

[Jarval]

Hey,

I have a quick question for those that are used to doing characters with ECL: How the heck does it work?

For example, take Devil: Hamatula. On page 212 of savage species, it says that the starting ECL is 14 but the LA is +5. The BAB is +9 and it has starting 9d8 HD.

So, does this mean that if I do a 1st level fighter Hamadula, this is going to be a 6th level character (+5 LA + 1 fighter), with 9d8 + 1d10 HD, and a +10 BAB? This doesn't seem right and I don't know exactly how to do this properly...
I'd appreciate some help.

Thanks and cheers,

SG

Equivalent Character Level is the combination of Level Adjustment, racial Hit Dice, and class level. You add LA to racial Hit Dice to give you the ECL of a creature without any class levels.

So taking the Hamatula as an example, you've got 9 racial Hit Dice, and a +5 Level Adjustment. This gives you a total ECL of 14. If you're taking the Hamatula up to ECL 30, you've still got 16 class levels to go.

In terms of your example, the 1st level Hamatula will count as a 15th level character for ECL and character starting wealth, but only as a 6th level character for feats and ability score increases (that is, it would have 3 feats and 1 ability score increase, just like any other 6th level character). The LA is there to cover its racial ability score modifiers and special abilities, so you can judge what level of characters have similar power.

 

[Pyrex]

Your ECL = (Racial HD + LA + Character Levels)

Ergo a Hamatula Ftr 1 would be ECL 15 = (9 Racial HD + 5 LA + 1 Character Level).

Note that the Hamatula in Savage Species is out-of-date. The one listed in the 3.5 SRD has 14hd and no LA listed.

 

[Jarval]

Note that the Hamatula in Savage Species is out-of-date. The one listed in the 3.5 SRD has 14hd and no LA listed.

12 HD according to the SRD, but you're right about it not having a listed LA. Which in general means that either the race isn't suitable for a player character (mindless constructs, oozes, or the like), or the HD + LA would be 20+. The core rules just don't support character's over 20th level at all.

 

[Ranger Rick]

I would like to do a Brb 9/Brd 1/DD 10/Epic 10. LE would be my alignment. As to the race, I am not sure.

 

[Steve Gorak]

Equivalent Character Level is the combination of Level Adjustment, racial Hit Dice, and class level. You add LA to racial Hit Dice to give you the ECL of a creature without any class levels.

So taking the Hamatula as an example, you've got 9 racial Hit Dice, and a +5 Level Adjustment. This gives you a total ECL of 14. If you're taking the Hamatula up to ECL 30, you've still got 16 class levels to go.

In terms of your example, the 1st level Hamatula will count as a 15th level character for ECL and character starting wealth, but only as a 6th level character for feats and ability score increases (that is, it would have 3 feats and 1 ability score increase, just like any other 6th level character). The LA is there to cover its racial ability score modifiers and special abilities, so you can judge what level of characters have similar power.

Thanks Jarval for the lightning quick answer!
It all makes sense

Cheers,

SG

 

[Steve Gorak]

Your ECL = (Racial HD + LA + Character Levels)

Ergo a Hamatula Ftr 1 would be ECL 15 = (9 Racial HD + 5 LA + 1 Character Level).

Note that the Hamatula in Savage Species is out-of-date. The one listed in the 3.5 SRD has 14hd and no LA listed.

Hmm, so does this mean that I need to take the one from the SRD or that that race isn't available?
Thanks and cheers,

SG

 

[Jarval]

Hmm, so does this mean that I need to take the one from the SRD or that that race isn't available?
Thanks and cheers,

SG

I think it's one of those "ask the DM" questions. Going by what Rkhet's said, you can't use the current SRD version, as it doesn't have a LA listed. On the other hand, given that Savage Species was listed as an allowed book, I can't imagine you'll have any problems if you use the version of the Hamatula presented in it.

Jarval, not the DM, so all answers to be taken with a pinch of salt...

 

[Jarval]

A few quick questions for the DM of my own:

1) Are we using the epic spell rules in this game? If so, do spellcasting characters who qualify for them get any epic spells at character creation? If not, can they acquire any through any means?

2) How do you feel about custom created magic items, using the rules from the DMG?

3) Are we starting at the base amount of XP for 30th level characters, or do we have any above and beyond that number?

 

[Steve Gorak]

Hmm, so does this mean that I need to take the one from the SRD or that that race isn't available?
Thanks and cheers,
SG

Actually, I wasn't clear with my question. Here it is:

1- Can we use creatures from the SRD to play as characters, using the HD+LA as the starting level?

2- If the La = -, can we assume it's 0?

3- If the answer is yes to 1 & 2, how do we determine the ability modifiers for that creature?

Thanks and cheers,

SG

 

[Pyrex]

Not the DM, so I can't answer 1 (but from his first post I believe it is allowed), but I can answer 2 & 3.

2: No. LA +0 creatures actually list LA+0. If the LA is "-" it means it's not suitable as a PC, usually either because it's mindless or because it's total ECL would be >20.

3: Subtract 10 from all even scores and 11 from all odd scores to determine ability modifiers.