Excavating a City/Moving tons of sand (Brainteaser: Lots of Math/Physics needed)

[frankthedm]

180mph winds taking only the first inch of sand off of a 1-square-foot area sounds... wrong. I know pretty much nothing about sandy desert that isn't apocryphal, but every sandy-desert-related movie and book I can remember being exposed to suggested that heavy winds can quickly transform the entire landscape.

A high-level druid with lots of windy spells just may do the trick. I'd pursue that avenue at least a little more if I were you.

Same here. Wind. Lots of it. Lots of it.

 

[Pyrex]

The problem with wind is that while it moves lots of sand around (rearranging 10' to 20' worth of sand dunes) the sand doesn't really *go* anywhere.

(Yes, I know that deserts slowly 'drift' over the course of decades, but that's really not fast enough for a 500' excavation)

 

[Moonstone Spider]

I'm not able to look at my books right now, but this would depend on how a Wall of Force interacts with its surroundings.

If it's fixed to a specific point in the plane that it's on then it can't be moved. But, if it's fixed to a general area and not to the plane itself then it would move when the general area moved.

Using arguments that were made when 'they' decided that teleporting doesn't stop momentum, casting a Wall of Force would either never work if you were on a planet moving through space because then the wall itself would be moving and not supported by the spell description. Or the casting of the wall would somehow halt the movement of the planet to make it fit within the spell paramaters (disastrous at best).

I would assume then that how the wall interacts with it's surroundings would be a DM call.

Which settings are actually on planets? I was under the impression that the default DnD setting was a discworld, hence the term "plane."

 

[szilard]

The problem with wind is that while it moves lots of sand around (rearranging 10' to 20' worth of sand dunes) the sand doesn't really *go* anywhere.

(Yes, I know that deserts slowly 'drift' over the course of decades, but that's really not fast enough for a 500' excavation)

With normal wind that's probably the case. With the aforementioned air elemental monolith, or an Elemental Swarm of air elementals working together, though?

-Stuart

 

[Pyrex]

Sure, an elemental can probably pick up and carry a fair amount of sand, but they've still got to pick it up, carry it a couple of miles away, put it back down, fly back, repeat.

Even with their huge carrying capacity, they're only going to be able to move so much sand so far before the relatively short duration of their conjuration expires.

I'll post some math on just how much sand an Air Elemental Monolith could be expected to move based on size and carrying capacity when I have time to do the math, but I expect they're not really going to fare any better than a Beholder.

 

[szilard]

I'll post some math on just how much sand an Air Elemental Monolith could be expected to move based on size and carrying capacity when I have time to do the math, but I expect they're not really going to fare any better than a Beholder.

If you base it on carrying capacity, it probably won't fare any better.

I suspect you'd have to turn to fluid mechanics to solve this one accurately, though.

-Stuart

 

[Nifft]

Incorporeality and Ring Gates would be my favored tactic.

Once you find the "front door", float a Ring Gate down there somehow, and let the sand blast out of the other Ring Gate until the front door has a nice gradient down to it.

Alternately, a permanent gate or teleport circle could do the job too. But again, you'd need to put it in front of (or slightly below) the front door.

Cheers, -- N

 

[two]

lyres of building

". The effect produced in but 30 minutes of playing is equal to the work of 100 humans laboring for three days. Each hour after the first, a character playing the lyre must make a DC 18 Perform (string instruments) check. "

Manufacture/create/buy 20 lyres.

DC 18 perform is trivial to an epic level party. Buff and get 20 players who can make this check/equip them with items to help hit DC18. 8th level bards should be enough (20 of them).

Have them perform 20 hours a day (rings of sus.).

Each lyre = 4,000 men's labour in 3 days.
20 lyres = 80,000 men's labour in 3 days PER DAY. Or 240,000 per day.

So in a week the result is 1,700,000 men working 7 days a week.

Or have the bards play continuously for a month; cast spells on them to relieve exhauastion, need for sleep, food, etc.

That will move a lot of sand.

 

[Nail]

Nail *does* make a great point though.

Unless the person doing the excavating plans on turning the city into a major metropolis / trade hub then it makes more sense to leave it buried and inhabit it in-place.

One of the major disadvantages of a walled city in a magic-filled world is the relative ease of flying (or flying monsters).

Sure, the (Epic) wall of force bubble helps, but I'll bet it can be taken down......unless it's obscured....like by, say, 500 ft of sand.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Incorporeality and Ring Gates would be my favored tactic.

Once you find the "front door", float a Ring Gate down there somehow, and let the sand blast out of the other Ring Gate until the front door has a nice gradient down to it.

"Whatever is put through one ring comes out the other, and up to 100 pounds of material can be transferred each day."

It's gonna take you a while.

-Hyp.