Excerpt: Minions. Go forth mine minions! Bring havoc with your 1 hp [merged]

[DandD]

Of course, seeing as the child isn't a player character, he's a minion at best when fighting anything in the game.

 

[GoodKingJayIII]

And the goblin doesn't break the versimilitude of the game, as he won't explode when a small child standing off to the side calls it a meanie and gets a lucky roll when it throws a rock at its head.

If the PCs have small children on their side, clearly the balance of encounter difficulty has changed. Therefore, more minions would be appropriate for sufficiently large numbers of children.

 

[med stud]

I don't think they live up to this, however. They're a minor tactical problem in large groups, and completely irrelevant in small ones.

I've done playtests with minions. The fighter thought "they are just minions!" and charged in. He missed two cleaves in a row and the minions would have knocked him out if not for the cleric. That was the dwarf pregen from KotS vs seven minions BTW. Minions are dangerous, not one-on-one but in groups.

That strikes me as a particularly unreasonable comparison. Take some monster stats that we actually know about: the goblin picador is attacking at +9 at level 2, and the level 6 legion devil minion is attacking at +11. That isn't a large difference, and they goblin also averages about 5 damage, same as the devil's set damage. And the goblin doesn't break the versimilitude of the game, as he won't explode when a small child standing off to the side calls it a meanie and gets a lucky roll when it throws a rock at its head.

An angry child throwing a stone doesn't deal any damage if you want to keep versimilitude. Otherwise a 2nd edition magic user could be killed by three angry kids throwing stones instead of one. Hell, even a first level fighter in 2nd edition that rolled bad for HP could be killed by children throwing rocks if there were many of them enough if that was attacks that dealt damage.

 

[Ginnel]

Seems like rolling or not rolling for damage would also be a dead give away.

Hmm True good point, you could vary the damage by rolling before hand if you'd like to give a bit more variety or just role it wouldn't take that long especially if you role in groups of attacking each PC.

I'm just gonna wait till players get used to minions then suddenly find that a hoard of monsters they are fighting don't go down in one hit(either i home brew a 2 hit minion or there actually is a hoard of statted monsters), que quite smirk/Muwhahahaa, but then that will be an exception rather than the rule as I think minions are a good idea.

 

[hong]

I don't think they live up to this, however. They're a minor tactical problem in large groups, and completely irrelevant in small ones.

"It's only a rabbit. I'll have its head off!"

That strikes me as a particularly unreasonable comparison. Take some monster stats that we actually know about: the goblin picador is attacking at +9 at level 2, and the level 6 legion devil minion is attacking at +11. That isn't a large difference,

ie, exactly as large as the rate at which AC increases: +1 per 2 levels.

and they goblin also averages about 5 damage, same as the devil's set damage.

IOW, 4 minions will do 4 times as much damage than the picador.

And the goblin doesn't break the versimilitude of the game,

You misspelled "believability". Hope this helps!

 

[Lizard]

Looking at the devil minions...plate armor+heavy shield only equals a +5 to AC?

 

[Knightlord]

...And the goblin doesn't break the versimilitude of the game, as he won't explode when a small child standing off to the side calls it a meanie and gets a lucky roll when it throws a rock at its head.

Minion status seems to function as a way to make PC's feel like badasses, but not so for commoners. In regards to *children* and indeed the rest of the common world, I suspect minions probably function like normal monsters. If not, then there would be no need for heroes, right? I mean, why summon a noble paladin to rid the village of a sinister Kobold infestation if farmer John can simply take up his pitchfork and mow down the Kobolds minions himself, Matrix-style?

 

[AllisterH]

re: Using a lower level monster instead of a minion.

Looking at the table from the excerpts, "Quests", a single level 9 minion has the same xp value as a level 1 standard monster.

Anyone want to compare two similar monsters (a minion soldier versus a soldier) that we have *official* stats for?

 

[keterys]

I don't think they live up to this, however. They're a minor tactical problem in large groups, and completely irrelevant in small ones.

In a recent battle I did a couple minions in back doing ranged attacks did a ton of damage while being ignored in favor of the 'dangerous guys'. The paladin had to beg the casters to stick their heads out and take care of them.

That strikes me as a particularly unreasonable comparison. Take some monster stats that we actually know about: the goblin picador is attacking at +9 at level 2, and the level 6 legion devil minion is attacking at +11. That isn't a large difference, and they goblin also averages about 5 damage, same as the devil's set damage. And the goblin doesn't break the versimilitude of the game, as he won't explode when a small child standing off to the side calls it a meanie and gets a lucky roll when it throws a rock at its head.

The DDM goblin's stats shouldn't be used for any comparison. They're based on when attacks and defenses were higher and the hp to damage ratio was far different.

Minions don't explode when small children get a lucky roll with a rock because _they don't fight small children_.

 

[keterys]

Looking at the devil minions...plate armor+heavy shield only equals a +5 to AC?

Shields add to reflex as well as AC. Plate doesn't let you get your int or dex bonus to AC, but you'd still get it to reflex.