Feat Problems With PHB II

[Question]

Wait....what is mighty composite bow? I havent heard of it before.

 

[MarkB]

Wait....what is mighty composite bow? I havent heard of it before.

It's a slightly outdated term. In 3.0, composite bows built with a strength bonus to damage were referred to as mighty composite bows.

 

[Bront]

Acrobatic Strike:

So a character who's spent 12 ranks in a skill gets an extra combat bonus for a potentialy risky tactic? Doesn't sound too bad given you need to be 9th level at least.

Crossbow Sniper:

Bows get full strength anyway at the cost of Gold, and Crossbows also need a feat to fire at a more reasonable rate. Certaintly not a table breaker.

Cunning Evasion:

What do you have to do to qualify for this one? Have Evasion and X ranks in Hide? Seems reasonable, and given that finding a good hiding spot can be hard in the middle of a battle, it's not nessessarily going to work. Besides, think hollywood movie where big explosion obscures the field for a moment and bad/good guy finds a spot to hide. I like this.

Defensive Sweep:

Not only is constant moving a good tactic, but this feat counters some of the abilities of many classes that require little to no movement (Dwarven Defender and Kalashtar Substitution SoulKnife to name two off the top of my head). Now, I'd like to know the reqs, and mechanicly how it works, but tis certaintly isn't a metagame thing as you explain it, it's a sense of combat tactics and taking advantage of an unmoving opponent (who rightfully should be taken advantage of)

Elven Spell Lore:

Flavor seems odd, but again, what are the reqs? Doesn't seem too out of balance, as it's only a single spell, and it doesn't let you bypass the maxes of Dispell anyway, so eventualy it becomes useless if it didn't do more.

...the list goes on...

The concept of introducing feats that are more useful and potent than core rules feats is a bad idea.

I won't even bother to go into the rest of the non-general feats. Needless to say, the "Bigger, Badder, Better" and the "Let's put any stupid idea we can think of down" syndromes have hit big time with regard to feats in the release of PHB II. JMO. YMMV.

Well, I know I'm buying the PHB II now. It looks like there are feats that are worth taking at higher levels now, and more options to make entertaining characters. I don't see any of these as game breaking, only different. I think you're missing the point of some of the qualifications of these feats, and it's hard looking at them outside of how you qualify for them. Whilrlwind attack is one of the most powerful feats in Core, but no one screams broken (at least that I hear) because it requires what, 5, 6 feats and a BAB +8 to get? Non-fighters will get it after 12th, fighters at 8th if they get the other feats first, which takes up a lot of their feats.

I think you're overreacting. It's like screaming epic feats are broken without pointing out that you have to be an epic character to get them (and in some cases, have multiple stats over 25 still). See how they play out first. Not everything that looks broken is once you use it in game, and there is more to this game than combat.

 

[Bront]

Wait....what is mighty composite bow? I havent heard of it before.

AKA strength bow. (Read the entry under composite longbows and shortbows)

 

[EyeontheMountain]

Acrobatic Strike:
Crossbow Sniper:
Cunning Evasion:
Defensive Sweep:
Elven Spell Lore:
Fiery Ki Defense:
Hindering Opportunist:
Indomitable Soul:
Keen Eared Scout:
Leap of the Heavens:
Mad Foam Rager:
Melee Weapon Mastery:
Overwhelming Assault:

Ranged Weapon Mastery:




Weapon Supremacy:

I really think you are getting a bit too hyper about this.

My comments:

Acrobatic Strike : A whole feat to get a plus four in limited(but easily acheiveable) circumstances. No problem

Crossbow sniper: Miniscule damage. Crossbows are so far behind bows even with this featt they are still non-viable.

Cunning Evasion: This is a bit much, I might agree, but again it is a feat. If a rogue i my game wants to take it, I would probably let them. It would need to be figured out when the Rogue took it, though.

Defensive Sweep: This is an AoO, of which most fighters get a whole one per round. But it is an excellent way to get more attacks, and at top BAB, even. But since it is 15th level, go for it. You should get something nice at 15th level.

Elven Spell Lore A good feat, but not totally a problem. I must admit I am annoyed at the 'elven magic' is superior Bull, but Int 17 is prettty much a given for any wizard. It is also mostly useless for spontaneous casters.

Hindering Opportunist. I agree it is mostly useless, and I will never take it.

Fiery Ki Defense I was wondering if you were serious about 'broken' It is a 10th level ability, and requires a use of stunning fist every time. Plus it is a pathetic 1d6 damage.

Indominable soul is quite powerful, I agree, but you do have to take two feats to get it, also (or one if a ranger) For the third spot in a feat chain, it is not too bad.

Keen Eared Scout Not a bad feat, overall. (Teh +5 versus Invisible is not bad) but I would probably never take it.

Leap of the heavens: Am I missing some kind of massive Combat-related Jump skill synergy or ability? Otherwise, who really cares.

Mad Foam Rager: Considering this obvioulsy means a spell or ability targeting or affecting you directly, I don't see a big problem. Sure you can live one more round after you fail your save-or-die spell, but how could you possibly be healed or have the effect dispelled? Even if it is delayed, it is still an instantaneous spell and cannot be dispelled. So maybe you can tkae them with you.

Melee Weapon Mastery: Other than saying this should really say Fighter 8th, I have no problems with it.

Overwhelming assault: Again +15 BAB, repeat +15 BAB. Good ability for a high-level feat. You know, Persistant spell is better than extend spell. the extra +5 level adjustment balances it.

Ranged weapon mastery: See Melee weapon mastery above. Also remember you need WF and WS for every weapon you use this with.

<<Getting tired and skipping tothe end>>

Weapon Supremacy: 18th level and a good amount of feats. Great abilities, which, unlike you say a mixed-bag, are preciselythe kind of abilities other classes get with their spells.

Bonuses on SR checks
Taking ten on concentration checks
and so on.

It is a very nice feat, especially consideringthe hell you ahve to go through to get there. (18 levels of fighter is a lot) And still probably not wiorth it.

 

[irdeggman]

I haven't gotten my copy of the PHB II yet so I'll have to wait to rationally comment until I can read the "details" and "prerequisites" of the fetas, but the way it sounds they are not exceptionally out of whack with other feats.

 

[Particle_Man]

Fighters have lots to do at those levels. The problem with the feat is not just that it does so much as it does so much disjointed unrelated stuff.

Fighters don't have nearly enough cool stuff to do at those levels. The PHB II gives them access to cool stuff, by having lots of feats that are desireable but require BAB +14 (which gives a fighter 6 slots for them pre-epic, compared to 2 for any other class) and one feat that requires 18 fighter levels.

Did you miss all those threads that say fighters are not worth playing beyond level 12 in 3.5 and not worth playing beyond level 4 in 3.0? Because you yourself, in this very thread, use the "fighters are not worth playing beyond level 4" in your own description of another feat in PHB II.

PHB II has the most useful collection of high level feats in D&D. Bar none.

 

[KarinsDad]

PHB II has the most useful collection of high level feats in D&D. Bar none.

I do not disagree with this statement.

I do think that some of their feats like Weapon Mastery and Weapon Supremacy were not well thought out.

As noted, why would any Fighter take Greater Weapon Focus at level 8 when they can take Weapon Mastery at level 8 which is more powerful than Greater Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Specialization combined?

 

[the Jester]

As noted, why would any Fighter take Greater Weapon Focus at level 8 when they can take Weapon Mastery at level 8 which is more powerful than Greater Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Specialization combined?

I predict that many fighters will take both in order to jack up their attack bonus.

 

[Caliban]

I do not disagree with this statement.

I do think that some of their feats like Weapon Mastery and Weapon Supremacy were not well thought out.

As noted, why would any Fighter take Greater Weapon Focus at level 8 when they can take Weapon Mastery at level 8 which is more powerful than Greater Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Specialization combined?

I agree that they need to be better worded. I think the attack and damage bonus for the Weapon Mastery feats is supposed to replace the bonuses for Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization. However, that's not what they wrote.

I'll allow it my game, but I won't let the bonuses stack. Hopefully the feat will be fixed/clarified by WOTC.