D&D 3E/3.5 Fighter build advice

[der_kluge]

I'm joining a 3.5 campaign.
The party has: a Wizard, a favored soul, a dwarven cleric, and some sort of paladin/rogue.

The GM said the group needs a front-line tank/fighter type. I'm OK with fighters, but not a big fan of barbarians or rangers, and I've never played a monk. He's suggesting dwarf, which is probably my least favorite race, but said it wasn't required. I guess the group is heading into the underdark, and I think they're in a dwarven settlement, so the dwarf thing made sense. But a subterranean race could also make sense, or anything if it's justified, I suppose.

At any rate, it's been a while since I've played 3.5, and I'm not very knowledgeable on the various fighter classes or PrCs. Looking for build suggestions for a character (And concept) that would really shine here. The GM indicated that ranged attacks would be useful (I guess dragons feature prominently here), as does the ability to fly (which could be solved with just winged boots, I suppose). The group is level 9.

Some other relevant info:
I own Complete Warrior, Complete Adventurer, the core books (not PHB 2), Libris Mortis, and Unearthed Arcana (And others which are probably less relevant here).

I like simple, and I'm not super into min-maxing, but I'm not opposed to it so long as it works. Also not a fan of "I've got a big hammer - smash!" kinds of characters. BORING.

Some of the relevant house rules:
Special races like assamir or tiefling have a -1 level adjustment
Races that have a normal level adjustment (human, et al) get +2 to any one stat not already modified by racial modifiers


Happy for any advice you guys have.

 

[balthanon]

So, if you're looking for something more out of the ordinary from a fighter perspective, could you get a hold of Tome of Battle? They're a lot of fun and if you want fairly simple while still being strong, they're good with a straight "Class 20" build and no multiclassing. (They're also amazing multiclassed, but it's not a necessity.) The only really complicated part is selecting maneuvers and it's far less maintenance than a wizard, cleric, or other spellcaster after you're done with leveling up while giving you some fun additional abilities that can be anything ranging from supernatural to fairly straight forward physical feats.

(Edit: cutting out ranger recommendation, since I didn't notice you said you didn't like them. )

If you have any thoughts on what you'd like to play thematically (races that you do like, what kind of things would you like to be able to do, etc...) that might help to narrow things down and get into more specifics.

 

[Deset Gled]

A monk will not be a good front line warrior or tank. And even if you don't want to just be a "hammer - smash!" fighter, you're probably going to need Power Attack. It allows you to convert to-hit bonuses to damage bonuses, which can be extremely tactically important.

If you have Complete Warrior and are looking for inspiration, I would just browse through the PrC section and pick one that seems interesting to you. Build backwards from there. That will be the easiest way to pick a concept and run with it without worrying too much about min/maxing. 3.5e has a ton of amazing options, but it can be overwhelming if you look at everything. Limiting yourself to the material in one splat book (plus core) is a good way to minimize stress while still building a fun character.

 

[der_kluge]

Looking at an Aasimar Paladin, with maybe Divine Crusader PrC. That seemed pretty interesting, though I'm not terribly into Tyr/Torm. Was trying to find a deity that's a little more off the beaten path. Tymora or Sune, perhaps.

Alternatively, was considering some sort of Paladin/Ranger (yea, I know what I said about rangers), but something with good frontline and ranged potential that is designed as a sort of dragon hunter build. That would also be highly interesting. Dragons would be the favored enemy. Though, I'm not sure if ranger is worth the splash for a +2 damage to dragons.

Another idea I was considering was some sort of Paladin/Bard combination, follower of Milil or Lliira - that would also be quite interesting.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I once played a half-orc ranger “bounty hunter”. His first favored enemy was orcs. His second was humans.

He was a sword & board build, using a flail and his spiked shield as his weapons.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

if you want something different, check out the Knowledge Devotion:

Knowledge Devotion: One Knowledge skill of your choice is a class skills (KS:Religion) regardless of the class you are advancing. Whenever you fight a creature, you can make a Knowledge check based on its type, provided that you have at least one rank in the appropriate Knowledge skill, gaining an insight bonus on Att/Dam rolls against that creature type for the remainder of the combat.

Arcana: constructs, dragons, magical beasts

Dungeoneering: aberrations, oozes

Local: humanoids

Nature: animals, fey, giants, monstrous humanoids, plants, vermin

Religion: undead

The Planes: outsiders, elementals

The bonus value depends on your Knowledge check result, as given on this table:

Check Result Bonus Granted

Up to 15 +1

16—25 +2

26—30 +3

31—35 +4

36+ +5

I used this feat as the core of an “Arcane Paladin” multiclassed warrior build*. With a high Int and a class selection that gave decent skill points, I was typically adding 2-3 points on al my Att/Dam rolls each combat.







* When the campaign fizzled, he was Marshal2/Duskblade2/Battle Sorcerer6 (w/Stalwart Sorcerer ACF: +2 HP/lvl & WeapFoc for fewer spells known)

 

[balthanon]

Looking at an Aasimar Paladin, with maybe Divine Crusader PrC. That seemed pretty interesting, though I'm not terribly into Tyr/Torm. Was trying to find a deity that's a little more off the beaten path. Tymora or Sune, perhaps.

Alternatively, was considering some sort of Paladin/Ranger (yea, I know what I said about rangers), but something with good frontline and ranged potential that is designed as a sort of dragon hunter build. That would also be highly interesting. Dragons would be the favored enemy. Though, I'm not sure if ranger is worth the splash for a +2 damage to dragons.

A paladin ranger focused on fighting evil dragons could be interesting-- Ranger isn't really worth splashing for the favored enemy (other than qualifying for prestige classes), but it is worth splashing for the skill points, ranged feats, and other elements of the class. If you wanted to combine the two with Divine Crusader I could see going with something simple like Ranger 3/Paladin 4/Divine Crusader 1/Other Prestige Class (progressing divine casting) X. As an Aasimar, you already have most of the Divine Crusader class abilities.

I assume most of what you don't like about ranger is the "wilderness" feel to it, so you could go with one of the alternates in Unearthed Arcana like the Urban Ranger.

The first D&D character I ever played (well, played longer term, since I joined a campaign right on the last session) was actually a half-drow cleric of Sune-- I can recommend that deity, she's a lot of fun. And given that you're going to be highly focused on Charisma with the spellcasting based on it plus Paladin abilities, you should fit right in. Given the restrictions on alignment for Divine Crusader, you might need to play the alternate version that can be Chaotic Good. (For gameplay purposes, Tymora probably has better domains to choose from, but Sune's ethos is definitely more fun to roleplay. )

Options for the "Prestige Class X" portion of the build could be something that continues in the full BAB category like Dragonslayer (Draconomicon, not a particularly good option, but thematic) or Fist of Raziel (Book of Exalted Deeds); or you can try and dip into some other prestige classes to pick up additional domains. If you have a particularly lenient DM, maybe you could even get him to let you take Prestige Paladin and Prestige Ranger after Divine Crusader to get Paladin and Ranger spells back while still getting full BAB. (Normally the prestige versions replace the base classes. Hmm... another issue is actually getting calm animals as a spell; the animal domain does work for this, but obviously Sune doesn't have it-- Planar Touchstone (Catalogs of Enlightenment) would likely work though.)

Ranger 3/Paladin 4/Divine Crusader 2/Prestige Paladin 3/Prestige Ranger 8 could be fun (or vice versa with more paladin than ranger). Take some metamagic feats in order to use your paladin and ranger spells effectively in higher level spell slots and the level order would definitely be mixed up a bit to distribute skill points and class features as desired. 8th level spells, +19 BAB, quite a few bonus feats and a decent amount of class progression. If you can throw in some feats or other methods of using Cha instead of other stats, you could be in pretty good shape for avoiding MAD too.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

A thought: Dwarves in 3.5Ed treated certain exotic weapons as martial weapons due to their prominence in Dwarven culture. You might want to look at those. Some are nifty, and might be enough of a hook to follow the DM’s suggestion.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Looking at an Aasimar Paladin, with maybe Divine Crusader PrC. That seemed pretty interesting, though I'm not terribly into Tyr/Torm. Was trying to find a deity that's a little more off the beaten path. Tymora or Sune, perhaps.

Alternatively, was considering some sort of Paladin/Ranger (yea, I know what I said about rangers), but something with good frontline and ranged potential that is designed as a sort of dragon hunter build. That would also be highly interesting. Dragons would be the favored enemy. Though, I'm not sure if ranger is worth the splash for a +2 damage to dragons.

Another idea I was considering was some sort of Paladin/Bard combination, follower of Milil or Lliira - that would also be quite interesting.

How about a holy warrior build, choosing a lunar deity.

The Shadowbane Inquisitor requires Turning Undead and Sneak Attack as prerequisites, so Cleric or Paladin/Rogue is the way to go there, but your idea for a Paladin/Ranger would be mechanically similar enough for most purposes.

 

[haakon1]

I like Core Rules, so I would a straight up Fighter, rather than a complex min-max thing. Probably Human for the extra Feat and Skill Points, or Half-Orc If Darkvision is a must. Archery feats should be Point Blank Shot then Precise Shot, optional after that. Melee feats should be Weapon specific, Power Attack then Cleave. Improved Initiative, or special choices that fit your story, are also good. Show them the most common character ever played - Human Fighter - is actually fun.