D&D 5E Fighting With Style, Fighting Styles as Level 1 subclass choices

[FrogReaver]

So it's +20 damage at 20th level? Every time? Sounds a might strong, even at per day (which I'm assuming applies to the cantrips as well). If the cantrips are at will and you want to add level to damage IDK know what to say.

firebolt vs longsword

4d10+20 vs 4d8+28 (assuming dueling style)

Makes them comparable to a fighter with extra attack (assuming no magic weapons)

 

[Fenris-77]

The underlying assumption is that a fighter class that ends up being a 1/3 caster should have the best cantrip in the game. You see the problem there right? It's not about the comparison to longsword, it's about the comparison to cantrips cast by full casting classes. Like I said, it seems like a bit much.

 

[Garthanos]

Okay. That has little to do with provide options for fighting styles that exemplify the archetype one plans on taking. Nothing about this proposal interferes with those who want to play that.

The farm boy luke skywalker was loaded with special talents even stepping off the farm his targeting ability was supernatural beyond anything duplicable by trained soldiers.

And our buddy Rand al Thor was trained by a Legendary Swordmaster of a rare and extraordinary style which included mental development and self hypnosis techniques that strengthened his mind and using a heirloom weapon and every one of them had abilities that amounted to reincarnation memories gifts from the Deva of 4e. He was a woodsman not so much a farmer if I recall.

I think pretending they are zero to hero is an error

 

[Xeviat]

The underlying assumption is that a fighter class that ends up being a 1/3 caster should have the best cantrip in the game. You see the problem there right? It's not about the comparison to longsword, it's about the comparison to cantrips cast by full casting classes. Like I said, it seems like a bit much.

They already have the best cantrip in the game: their attack action.

The Eldritch Knight can cantrip and make a weapon attack, though, so +Fighter level to cantrip damage would be way too much.

4d12 (poison spray) + 2d6+5 is 26+12, or 38 without great weapon fighter. 4 Greatsword attacks is 53.33 with great weapon fighter. So you could afford like +half fighter level to cantrip damage, or +Int to cantrip damage and something else, not +fighter level.

Also, this is level 20; remember, the fighter doesn't get 4th attack till 20th, so your be way ahead for a while before that.

 

[Fenris-77]

I'm 100% ok with +INT and there are lots of precedents.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

In another thread, we were talking about wanting to move the fighter subclass to first level. I think this would be a simple way of doing it. +1d4 elemental damage to your attacks isn't that much more than duelist's +2 damage, but maybe you could gate it behind knowing the Arcana skill.

I like this.

If you cap the d4 a 1/turn you probably don't need to gate it.

Yep!

What about:

You gain two evocation cantrips and 1 first level evocation spell that you can cast once per day. When you cast either cantrip or this spell you can add your fighter level to the damage dealt.

(I think this also has the potential to fix the eldritch knight war magic ability)

Too much. That’s a full feat.

Wesley is an example of how heroic fiction often features super versatile characters

Yep he’s a rogue. The versatile non magical skill class.

The farm boy luke skywalker was loaded with special talents even stepping off the farm his targeting ability was supernatural beyond anything duplicable by trained soldiers.

And our buddy Rand al Thor was trained by a Legendary Swordmaster of a rare and extraordinary style which included mental development and self hypnosis techniques that strengthened his mind and using a heirloom weapon and every one of them had abilities that amounted to reincarnation memories gifts from the Deva of 4e. He was a woodsman not so much a farmer if I recall.

I think pretending they are zero to hero is an error

They started as farm boys, and then found or learn or otherwise gained rad powerz over time. And Rand is a sheepherder. A “whooly-headed sheepherder” as one of his girlfriends regularly calls him. Which is a kind of farmboy. They live in the woods, ish, on the edge of town, in a very safe place.

I'm 100% ok with +INT and there are lots of precedents.

I like adding 1d4+Int elemental damage to a creature within 5 ft when you make a weapon attack, 1/turn. Directly comparable to Dueling.

 

[FrogReaver]

Too much. That’s a full feat.

It would be the worst feat choice ever on a fighter class - A feat restricted to evocation damage cantrips and spells on a fighter class that already gets all the damage scaling via extra attack. It's mostly just empowering said fighter to make use of the cantrips he choose at times instead of weapon attacks - since they scale about as well now. I honestly thought leaving it at cantrip attacks that were equal to his weapon attacks was not good enough and thus the level 1 spell cast.

Anyways, you don't like it and that's what really counts here.

 

[FrogReaver]

I like adding 1d4+Int elemental damage to a creature within 5 ft when you make a weapon attack, 1/turn. Directly comparable to Dueling.

1d4+int is better than dueling for basically the whole game (providing you up int after str). It's at least better up until tier 4 as long as you have 16 int.

 

[Garthanos]

They started as farm boys, and then found or learn or otherwise gained rad powerz over time.

Yeh found exotic class swordsmanship and heirloom weaponry directly from the man who raised him that is so I repeat incredibly not starting at zero. And being a shepherd is not the foundation of his abilities. In 4e he might have had any number of backgrounds for flavor like shepherd (but flavor is all it is exotic birth story is probably more appropriate) Honestly he was more of a archer ranger than anything else at his lower levels.

 

[FrogReaver]

They already have the best cantrip in the game: their attack action.

The Eldritch Knight can cantrip and make a weapon attack, though, so +Fighter level to cantrip damage would be way too much.

4d12 (poison spray) + 2d6+5 is 26+12, or 38 without great weapon fighter. 4 Greatsword attacks is 53.33 with great weapon fighter. So you could afford like +half fighter level to cantrip damage, or +Int to cantrip damage and something else, not +fighter level.

Also, this is level 20; remember, the fighter doesn't get 4th attack till 20th, so your be way ahead for a while before that.

yea, war magic breaks it. It's not good enough without war magic IMO. So that design won't work.