Five-Minute Workday Article

[Obryn]

Dungeons & Dragons Roleplaying Game Official Home Page - Article (The Five-Minute Workday)

I ... um ... I'm kind of speechless here.

It seems to say, "No, we're not doing anything inside the system to address any possible five-minute workdays. We're going to tell the DM not to make adventures which allow it."

Which is fine, but it just strikes me as kind of lazy, from a design standpoint. Or at least, it's no improvement over anything that's been offered before.

-O

 

[JamesonCourage]

I think they've said this, more or less, in a Rule of Three article as well. That seems to be the plan going forward.

EDIT: Here's the link on what I was remembering. It seems to talk about HP being the cap, and giving DMs the ability to plan around it; that is, if you want just one big battle for the day, it needs to take X rounds, where X is the number of rounds in a "typical" adventuring day. At least, that's about what I took from it.

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

Yeah, that's... pretty impressively bad, IMHO. He basically blames the DM for a problem with the system.

Hey, let's try that approach elsewhere!

"We've heard that archers are weak and boring, so we're suggesting that each encounter include at least 25% flying creatures to make them more necessary."

"The knowledge skills in the game seem unnecessarily fractured, so we suggest that every dungeon contain at least one magical riddle that requires a Knowledge check."

"The halfling race is underpowered, so we're suggesting that at least one floor of each dungeon have 4-foot ceilings."

 

[LostSoul]

If one of their ways to "fix" it is something like "Here is how you can introduce costs to resting" then I'm fine with their approach.

 

[GX.Sigma]

It's weird that, in the edition that's supposed to let you choose what kind of game you want to play, their solution to the 5-minute workday is to balance the game around an assumed amount of combat per day.

The sixth paragraph brings it back in, though: "If the group spends less time in fights, casters grow stronger. If the characters spend more rounds fighting, the fighter and rogue grow stronger." (emphasis mine)

This ties in with what the Rule-of-Three said earlier: if you have only one fight per day, it will take more rounds, so the daily resources balance will still even out. Which I think is what he wanted to say in this article, but he instead decided on a very unfortunate choice of words.

Either way, it doesn't seem like it actually addresses the problem--you can make PCs capable of doing a longer adventuring day, but there's still no mechanical reason for them not to rest after each fight.

Not that there should be--I believe that the 5mwd is an issue of playstyle and scenario design, and there's no real need for the game system to address it. I support the system Mike details; it's probably the only way to balance traditional daily resources (i.e., give a bunch of guidelines, then tell people it's okay to ignore them). He just didn't explain it very well.

 

[Raith5]

I wish I could XP you ZombieRoboNinja

I just cant see why in the world I would part with hard earnt cash for a "crystal clear guideline". Surely something as fundamental to the game as pacing and use of resources requires something more than this. At least some mechanics please!

 

[Stalker0]

I'm of two minds here:

On the one hand, I respect that 5e as a whole is moving back towards DM empowerment. The designers have made it clear that they are giving more direct control back to the DM, and that the system will not be as rules based as it has been in the past. In other words, there is a lot of "fuzzy" areas that will need DM action instead of direct rules.

That said, I don't know if Dnd has ever experimented with mechanics to curb the desire to rest. Not simply mechanics that reduce the problem like encounter powers....but mechanics that actually change the players incentive so that mechanically they WANT to continue adventuring instead of resting.

Now at the beginning of playtest seems an excellent time to try. Why not throw us a few ideas, let us give them a shot, see what comes of it.

 

[Cadfan]

So the official stated opinion of the designers of 5e is that the game does not support adventuring days in which the players engage in a single, simple fight that isn't an epic, lengthy, knock down brawl.

Good to know, I guess.

I'm six sessions into a 4e game. Every game session I've run so far would probably not work with 5e, if this description is accurate. My 4e game has too little combat to be translated into 5e.

 

[Markn]

I'd give you XP but "must spread around" Stalker0.

I agree completely with what you said.

I am certain that this is not an easy endeavor since power levels change as levels are gained and because of this I think whatever ideas that get tried need to be tested at low, mid, and high levels for balance.

But you are spot on. This playtest is the time to try a few new things.

One thing does worry me though. Despite designers stating they want to get the game right, there must be some corporate pressure to get a new game out. A polarizing issue like this, along with its play testing could delay the game by another 6 months (on top of the already planned timetable they may have internally). Maybe that's why the issue isn't being fully explored. I mean- the L&L article and Rule of 3 article have both been slammed pretty hard. Harder than anything else I've seen to date and WotC seem to be sweeping it under the rug.

 

[Raith5]

On the one hand, I respect that 5e as a whole is moving back towards DM empowerment. The designers have made it clear that they are giving more direct control back to the DM, and that the system will not be as rules based as it has been in the past. In other words, there is a lot of "fuzzy" areas that will need DM action instead of direct rules.

I agree with this but DM empowerment relies upon players empowering and trusting the DM and the style of game for the game to work at any given table. This 'social contract' between players and DM requires some mechanics or rules than are a bit stronger than guidelines.

I dont think pacing mechanics (encounter powers, milestones, recharging powers) undermine or obviate the power of the DM, it just gives a common framework for the players and the DM.