D&D 3E/3.5 Fixing 3.5 druids - for felon

[Jack]

This thread assumes you think 3.5 druids are OTT

if you disagree - bu**er off

what would you do - better what have you done in a real campaign just using core 3.5 rules - to redress the balance?

for myself I like the idea of getting rid of the animal companion once the druid gets wildshape. it reduces the power of the class but since once they get wildshape they get access to pretty much all the creatures they could have as an animal companion it doesn't really reduce the access to special abilities/powers they have.

 

[Felon]

LOL, don't do it for me, Jack, do it for yourself.

You suggest excising the animal companion, but ask yourself not what you wish to pare away, but what's essential to keep. I say this because the spirit shaman from the Complete Divine can fill the druid's shoes quite nicely conceptually, without being this hoss melee monster that the druid winds up being. Have you seen the spirit shaman?

 

[Jack]

nope - but one of my players - a 3.5 powergamer playing a druid, surprise surprise, does. so i'll have a look. what's so great about this class?

btw i favour getting rid of the animal companion on mechanical grounds. i've noitced that it - almost another player - slows the game down. and at higher levels I imagine the probably frequent death of the animal companion - but who really cares it can be replaced every 24 hours - creates a pain for the party if they are adventuring in an alien plane they have to return to the prime material to get a replacemrnt

 

[Felon]

Yes, all of that's correct. The animal companion (which should just be called "riding dog" just to avoid giving people the illusion that there are other equally-good companions) is executed very poorly.

The spirit shaman has the same flavor as the druid, but the "spirit" part is where it's different. It's not a class with overt physical abilities. It does not have a physical animal companion, but rather a spirit guide that only the shaman can see. He casts spells from the druid list, but spontaneously. Every day the spirit guide "barters" with nature spirits for the spells that the druid will select, so while the druid only knows a few spells at any given time (like the sorcerer), he can choose different known spells every day.

Bottom line is that it's a pretty potent class, but it's not going to outshine any fighters.

You should really edit this post and drop the "for felon" part so other folks won't feel like this is a private discussion.

And accomplishing that, a moderator should in turn move this to House Rules.

 

[Wormwood]

Wave goodbye to Natural Spell for a start.

 

[ForceUser]

The only thing I'd change about the 3.5 druid is I'd remove spontaneous summon nature's ally. There are plenty of abilities one could nerf, but for me, that's what puts the class over the top in comparison to its 3.0 predecessor.

 

[Crothian]

ott means??

edit: over the top i imagine.....

I'd start with removing the druid class entirely and start from scratch. I would then decide what exactly the druid class is as the one in the PHB is not exactly clear on that.

 

[Brother MacLaren]

and at higher levels I imagine the probably frequent death of the animal companion - but who really cares it can be replaced every 24 hours

Have you ever actually seen a player RP a druid this way, so completely uncaring about whether the animal lives or dies ("who really cares, I'll just get a new one")?

My druid, faced with the option of saving the life of his animal companion or a party member, would choose the dog. In fact, that's why he's about to Awaken and free his companion, as I think most mid-level druids would do if they led dangerous lives. Now, I know that roleplaying limitations aren't supposed to balance out mechanical advantages, but what you've described is an absolutely abominable attitude, certain to earn the druid the hatred of every good and neutral member of his order.

 

[RisnDevil]

You say the Spirit Shaman fills the roll conceptually, but by that do you mean to replace the Druid with it? If not, then what would you do to modify the Druid, keeping the Spirit Shaman in mind?

 

[Felon]

Have you ever actually seen a player RP a druid this way, so completely uncaring about whether the animal lives or dies ("who really cares, I'll just get a new one")?

Sure, I've seen this. Why so surprised? Not everyone immerses themselves into their characters all that deeply. There are entire groups of players who treat D&D like it's a tactical miniatures game. That's how they enjoy themselves.

You say the Spirit Shaman fills the roll conceptually, but by that do you mean to replace the Druid with it? If not, then what would you do to modify the Druid, keeping the Spirit Shaman in mind?

I'd say the Spirit Shaman can replace the druid completely. It casts the druid's spells and fields the proper skills.