D&D 5E Flying PCs

[humble minion]

I've recently started a campaign with a new group, that's perhaps a bit more character optimisation focused than I'm used to, and with a DM that's a bit more lassiez-faire. Two of the five PCs have turned out to be of races with a natural fly speed.

I'm playing a human artificer, focused on support etc, and honestly, it's not feeling like a level playing field. Flight is such an enormously powerful ability, it makes many encounters non-threatening (so long as you have a ranged attack), and trivialises many exploration challenges. And most races who have it, also have other abilities as well. WotC don't seem to weight it heavily, on the balance scale. Owlin for instance - flight AND free Stealth proficiency AND good darkvision? Honestly, if I were running a game these days I'd be very tempted to put a blackban on it, with a possible exception for things like the protector artificer or hadozee for who it is limited.

What experiences have other player/GMs had with flying PCs. Do you allow them in your games? Do they throw out the balance? Is your PC party full of fairies, aarakocra, owlin, and winged tieflings?

 

[Mort]

I DM'd for my son's group for a bit and it had an aarakocra (flying bird race with a fly speed).

Certain low level challenges weren't. As you say exploration challenges were trivialized unless they were designed with flight in mind/diffently.

Certain monsters (those with no range) became speedbumps IF the group was focused (they were 12 at the time).

Indoor and "dungeon" environs played mostly the same (certain traps were easier, but that was ok).

All in all, it was ok once I kept it in mind - but for MANY groups that itself is a problem. Especially those that run primarily published adventures (as you can't design around an individual).

Will certainly agree that it can cause problems for most groups, especially at low levels.

 

[Oofta]

I don't allow them. I even have a fairly open magic mart but ability to fly is not an option until much higher levels.

As you said, it just changes the nature of the game. As a DM I can counter that with monsters that fly themselves or have ranged attacks but that artificially limits me to picking monsters specifically to counter group abilities. I'd rather pick monsters that make sense for the scenario at hand. The DM can also throw in more underground or indoor encounters. Underground could be fun when the flyers start running into giant spider's webs that otherwise have no impact on the encounter budget. But that gets into adversarial DMing which I try to avoid.

I don't have a great solution other than ask to see if you can get boots or a broom of flying. You will always be at a disadvantage.

P.S. If I were running a game where they were allowed I'd remind the owlin PC that they can't hide when they're literally flying around in the open. There's no reason they're not going to be clearly seen. But that's another issue.

 

[iserith]

When there are flying race options in my campaigns, I don't really see too much of a problem with them. Generally, their inclusion in my games is for thematic reasons. (I don't usually do "kitchen sink" games.) I've never excluded a flying race simply because they can fly.

Monsters with ranged attacks, ceilings in a dungeon, and strong wind in the wilderness level the playing field. You can even make a house rule regarding encumbrance and flying if you want. What I've found is that flying comes with added risk, too. As an example, if you get knocked prone, you're taking falling damage. And if you're dropped to 0 while flying, you hit the ground and auto-fail a death save. That immediately gives you a 5% of death if you're not healed before your next turn.

As for exploration chalenges, sure, you're going to be able to fly over some pits every now and again. But those aren't significant challenges anyway past a certain level, so I wouldn't worry about one PC being able to fly over a pit and secure a rope or the like for others to cross. It's not like they wouldn't have figured out how to circumvent the pit some other way.

 

[Mort]

P.S. If I were running a game where they were allowed I'd remind the owlin PC that they can't hide when they're literally flying around in the open. There's no reason they're not going to be clearly seen. But that's another issue.

Sure, but an Owlin at night, if the opponents don't have darkvision - that could be nasty.

Heck and owlin shadow sorcerer or warlock that can see in his own darkness would be a terror at night - ESPECIALLY to those with darkvision who would not expect to be hampered by darkness.

 

[jmartkdr2]

My experience is a little different - I find that if you run a variety of monsters and challenges flight becomes a situational ability - great outdoors if the enemies don't have ranged options and they won't just flee (or making them flee is good enough).

But that might be a reflection of y style of play - I like to run dungeons where flight is only situationally useful. In an exploration-focused game, it's probably stupidly OP to let pc's fly. Even flying familiars can be a bit much in that situation.

As a player, I rarely ask for flight, and if I do I often temper it. Not because I think a dm can't handle it, but because I know a lot of dm's don't want to and flight is not a character concept by itself. I'm currently playing a winged tiefling, but her whole backstory was about losing her wings and adventuring to get them back - something the dm therefore had control over. She would of course ask any powerful npcs who owed her a favor to help her, but the dm could always just say no until he was ready to say yes. (which has happened in the game. I'm still not the most OP pc in that group.)

 

[Oofta]

Sure, but an Owlin at night, if the opponents don't have darkvision - that could be nasty.

Heck and owlin shadow sorcerer or warlock that can see in his own darkness would be a terror at night - ESPECIALLY to those with darkvision who would not expect to be hampered by darkness.

Any creature that has a longbow and darkvision is going to be at significant advantage against creatures that don't have darkvision when it's dark. That's especially true if they have more than the standard 60 foot darkvision range and environments where they can target enemies from a distance.

Flying compounds the issue because it opens up many more situations where they can attack from range.

 

[RoughCoronet0]

My world has six playable flying species, two that give temporary flight capabilities, three lineages that can gain flight depending on the base species, and another nine that can gain either permanent or temporary flight capabilities at higher level through species feats. That’s about 20 out of 74 possible lineages that have some level of flight.

My world is highly magical and dangerous, and with many races having flight capabilities (some being more populous races too) many enemies have means of dealing with creatures that fly, so it’s not always an overbearing advantage. So I persoanally don’t have an issue with flight in my games.

 

[Vaalingrade]

I've never had any issues because I went in intending to have fliers in my games.

So fights out on the open plains are a sometimes food. Instead, there's trees or the indoors and when we're outside, any monster with hands knows how to pick up and throw things.

Also, I emphasize teamwork on my games nd no one is dumb enough to split the party or charge in ahead because 'flight'.

 

[Stoutstien]

To be fair artificer do get flight via infusions just a bit later.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Being the only flying character in a group is extremely deadly. It's easy to get separated and run into a group encounter solo.

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

I've recently started a campaign with a new group, that's perhaps a bit more character optimisation focused than I'm used to, and with a DM that's a bit more lassiez-faire. Two of the five PCs have turned out to be of races with a natural fly speed.

I'm playing a human artificer, focused on support etc, and honestly, it's not feeling like a level playing field. Flight is such an enormously powerful ability, it makes many encounters non-threatening (so long as you have a ranged attack), and trivialises many exploration challenges. And most races who have it, also have other abilities as well. WotC don't seem to weight it heavily, on the balance scale. Owlin for instance - flight AND free Stealth proficiency AND good darkvision? Honestly, if I were running a game these days I'd be very tempted to put a blackban on it, with a possible exception for things like the protector artificer or hadozee for who it is limited.

What experiences have other player/GMs had with flying PCs. Do you allow them in your games? Do they throw out the balance? Is your PC party full of fairies, aarakocra, owlin, and winged tieflings?

In most of the games I run, I do not generally allow them.
I would generally regard continuous flight as roughly of the same power level as resistance to damage.

 

[Oofta]

In most of the games I run, I do not generally allow them.
I would generally regard continuous flight as roughly of the same power level as resistance to damage.

If you allow them, have you had players with the same issues as the OP? What did you do, if anything, to help alleviate the issues?

 

[ad_hoc]

I don't like having them as PCs. Just doesn't have the right feel for me.

That said, unless the entire party flies encounters are still dangerous because some of the party are vulnerable.

It is similar to having a 25 AC character in a party. They're likely going to be the last PC to die, but they're still going to die when the rest of the party has been wiped out.

I think a great D&D adventure has varied challenges.

One thing I've noticed with "optimized" characters is that they do exceptionally well in their ideal scenario but they're in real trouble when faced with a challenge they weren't built for. To me D&D is all about those challenges and coming up with solutions.

I have noticed on optimization discussions that there is a strong attitude that a DM must cater challenges to the PCs strengths or they are a bad DM. Then they say the game is too easy.

 

[jgsugden]

Having flight is a bit like being stealthy - it is hard to get you with certain attacks, and you end up isolated and easily overpowered at times.

Let's say a monster force is going to come in and attack - making 8 attacks on the first round. If a PC is hidden, those 8 attacks will end up being split amongst the other PCs. The same is true if they are melee attacks and one PC is flying instead of being hidden.

On the flip side, if a PC takes to the sky and is up there by themself, it is entirely possible that their flight may make them an easy target for a group of flying enemies that gang up on the PC because it is isolated from allies that can't get to it to support it. A lone PC flying in the sky that ecounters a group of archer enemies may find an overwhelming number of arrows connecting with them ...

To these ends - I don't think about whether a PC in my game can fly. It has advantages and disadvantages ... PCs need to balance the risks and rewards nd decide how much risk they are willing to take.

Ah, but what about how it trivializes certain types of encounters? No need to leap across a pit. They can scout out wilderness areas, fly over forest fires, etc.... That, my friends, is cool. It makes the PC feel cool and special. Itis one of the things that make them heroes. Similar to a stealthy rogue that can spy, a wizard that can turn invisible, or a barbarian that can shrug off trap damage ... PCs that can do things other PCs can't do should not be lamented - they should be celebrated for the things that make them cool.

So what do I do? I run my party ability agnostic adventures and let the players and their characters celebrate their wins, struggle through the challe nges that him them harder, and feel like people adventuring in a world rather than players in a strategy game designed to balance both sides of the game.

 

[cbwjm]

We've had a bird person in a group I run in with flight, didn't seem all that disruptive, especially when we end up inside. Same with a mini campaign I ran with my home-brewed fairy class. It's actually quite fun as if he scouts a dungeon it means he misses traps that end up catching others.

 

[Bacon Bits]

Overall, I've found that it's largely not a problem. It seems like it should be, but in the end it nearly always isn't an issue. I've seen a few instances where flying was really useful, but in the aggregate, it really hasn't been much better than having a character with Athletics proficiency and a rope.

In general, most flying races have some inherent limitations on natural flight. Several flying PC races have to use their arms to maintain flight, meaning they can't use ranged weapons or cast spells. However, the real limitation is that basically nobody with winged flight has hover while naturally flying. That's potentially a significant limitation.

The first key to remember is that flying makes you a huge target. You can't easily hide, and you have no cover and little concealment. In most cases, flying is incredibly dangerous because it's very much not subtle. Think how often you notice flying insects compared to those on the ground, or birds in the air compared to those in the trees. You're exposed when you're flying.

It can be obnoxious in situations where the NPCs don't have any ranged weapons, but I just haven't seen that that is a big issue very often.

IMO, my biggest dissatisfaction isn't the balance of it. It's the realism. There are no rules on the aeronautical limitations of nonmagical flight. Like this is all it says for fly speeds for players:

Flying creatures enjoy many benefits of mobility, but they must also deal with the danger of falling. If a flying creature is knocked prone, has its speed reduced to 0, or is otherwise deprived of the ability to move, the creature falls, unless it has the ability to hover or it is being held aloft by magic, such as by the fly spell.

And this is it for monsters:

A monster that has a flying speed can use all or part of its movement to fly. Some monsters have the ability to hover, which makes them hard to knock out of the air. Such a monster stops hovering when it dies.

Well... how far do they have to move forward to maintain level flight if they can't hover? How quickly can they turn? How quickly can they climb or descend? How much room do they need for their wings? Earlier editions had rules just for this. Yeah, the 3e maneuverability chart sucked, but what do we get instead in 5e? Nothing. The game almost treats it like everything has old-school perfect maneuverability. It's frustrating just how little guidance there is here. It's definitely simple, but it's also pretty dumb.

A strict reading says that all hover does is prevent you from falling if you're knocked prone or incapacitated, but in the past we've ruled otherwise and basically made people average maneuverability. That's significantly more restrictive than the RAW for flight, but I liked it a lot better.

 

[Clint_L]

I don't allow them because they are overpowered at low levels and a pain in the butt, but also because I just think they are kind of dumb looking and annoy me at an aesthetic level.

Edit: note that I use miniatures a lot.