Force Orb versus Object

[Rashak Mani]

Force Orb is a wizard lvl 1 Encounter power.

Target says "creature or object". If you hit you get secondary attacks against all adjacent enemies.

So if my ally is completely surrounded by enemies. Could I target a pebble underneath him and have all enemies getting hit by the secondary attack ? Without hurting him too.

What is the difficulty in hitting a small immobile target ?

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This "tactic" seems worthwhile even to hit two adjacent foes instead of just blasting one enemy with the primary attack. Primary is 2d8+Int & Secondary attacks are 1d10+Int. So hitting two enemies would be 2 x d10+Int... much more damage.

 

[PHGraves]

While I want to say "No" to targeting the pebble, I cannot find any rule that points one way or the other.

As to your second part, think it through again. If they are adjacent, then blasting one with primary damage will hit the other with secondary damage.
2 x 1d10+Int is not more than 2d8+Int + 1d10+Int

 

[Dancing_Rage]

I think OP is thinking of the classic 7-10 split, where you've got 2 enemies that are NOT adjacent to each other but are adjacent to one empty space.

I'd permit it if I were DMing but that's just because you can always aim at the ground for something like that (just don't do it at your own feet....) and then let it go from there. So you'd be aiming at the ground to use the burst to hit the 2 enemies at the sides of the burst. Adjucating it from there isn't my deal, but seems fairly straightforward from there, roll an attack roll and then have the enemies roll resist, etc.

Edit: I think if you're targetting your ally because they're surrounded by enemies, you will most likely be nuking that character for 2d8+int mod and then the surrounding enemies for 1d10, etc. I.E., not a good idea.

 

[Anthony Jackson]

So if my ally is completely surrounded by enemies. Could I target a pebble underneath him and have all enemies getting hit by the secondary attack ?

Is it all adjacent enemies, or all adjacent targets? Because your friend is still adjacent to the pebble. Assuming it reads enemies, sure, targeting the ground is legal.

 

[PHGraves]

Assuming it reads enemies, sure, targeting the ground is legal.

I have an issue with this reading. If the ground qualifies for the targeting definition of an object, why do some powers list "unoccupied square" as a target?

 

[Andur]

Pebble in the square would have have cover from the PC in the square.

 

[James McMurray]

It's a valid tactic. You're giving up primary damage to increase the odds of hitting multiple opponents. As to defense, I'd say that you could target the ground, which would have at most a 5 AC. I's probably just say "don't roll a 1."

I have an issue with this reading. If the ground qualifies for the targeting definition of an object, why do some powers list "unoccupied square" as a target?

Presumably those powers did something funky during play testing when they were allowed to target occupied squares.

 

[PHGraves]

It's a valid tactic. You're giving up primary damage to increase the odds of hitting multiple opponents. As to defense, I'd say that you could target the ground, which would have at most a 5 AC. I's probably just say "don't roll a 1."



Presumably those powers did something funky during play testing when they were allowed to target occupied squares.

Actually, my issue stems from the fact that several powers list as viable targets "Object or Unoccupied Square". If there is a clear demarcation between "object" and "unoccupied square", why is it ok to use "object" to refer to an unoccupied square?

 

[Anthony Jackson]

I have an issue with this reading. If the ground qualifies for the targeting definition of an object, why do some powers list "unoccupied square" as a target?

Well, not all square contain ground. Also, some powers can only target unoccupied squares, and in some cases it may be worth emphasizing the fact that you can target an unoccupied square.

 

[James McMurray]

Ghost Sound: it's so you can make it sound like an object is creating noise, or the noise is coming from thin air

Light: same thing

Those are the only two in the PHB.

Also, nobody is using "object" to refer to "unoccupied square." They're using it to refer to objects like "the ground" and "a pebble."