Forced teleport question - dropping the target

[Black Knight Irios]

And in most of those circumstances forced movement would work as well. And if you like to force someone into a pit or over a cliff the target gets a save and if successful falls prone in the last safe square. It's not like teleporting upwards opens up endless possibilities for broken combos.

It was said before a DM should create the terrain where the encounters will be run according to party level. A push 1 can kill a creature if the terrain allows it. And that can happen starting at lvl1.

Therefore, I see no reason why teleporting in 3D should cause that many problems.

 

[Mirtek]

..except that only protects you against a moderate fall anyway.

I know, but that's only name I could recall from the top of my head. I wanted to name the boots that totally prevent all falling damage, but I just can't remember what they're called

 

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Well, there are Airstriders, whose property prevents fall damage, but those are a level 25 item. Winged Boots have the same property (well, in terms of fall damage), but are only level 13.

There are also Cat Tabi, which start at level 8, though that's through a daily power rather than a property.

Feyleaf Sandals, level 2, also have a daily power that prevents falling, though my read of them require a surface to teleport to in order to prevent the fall.


Ring of Featherfall, level 14 (and a ring, obviously, not boots) also has a daily that prevents falling damage, which can be used to save the whole party if you have had a milestone and they are close enough (and are all falling at the same time).

Ring of Perfect Grip, level 14, as a daily allows you to autopass the save to avoid falling, and its property makes it unlikely you'd fail in the first place.

Purple Dragon Commander's Ring, level 16, has a daily that prevents fall damage.

Ring of flying, level 20, prevents fall damage.

Dragonrider armour, level 11+, also has a daily that lets you fall without taking damage.

Davros Elden's Aeriel step, level 13, is grandmaster training that prevents all falling damage as a property... pretty sweet, and its daily lets you fly for a move action.

Finally, the elexir of flying (level 21 consumable) will also let you avoid falling damage, provided you can drink it and start flying in time.

 

[keterys]

And in most of those circumstances forced movement would work as well.

Not if you want to teleport someone through a castle arrowslit. Or over a banister surrounding the ship that prevents forced movement from leaving the deck. Or make someone prone _inside_ the zone of lava or whatever, making it harder to escape, instead of outside it.

Or stick someone under a metal grating, in an iron maiden, etc.

There are lots of times teleport is more useful than forced movement.

 

[Black Knight Irios]

OTOH, on a save only the part of the forced movement that would endanger the target is avoided and the target is prone. Whereas the teleport is canceled completely if it endangers the target.

EDIT:
I don't want to sound like 3D teleport can't be abused. But there is forced movement which can be abused and a DM must be aware of both possibilities. Then again, it is not like 3D teleports will turn each and every encounter into godmode for playerchars.

 

[Gradine]

I don't see how any ruling that provides players creative alternative ways to use their powers can be necessarily a bad thing. I'm not a huge fan of save-or-die myself and I'm glad that 4e has for the most part done away with them, but if it's one thing that 4e lacks it's imaginative use of powers in combat.

The save-or-die of a push/slide/teleport off a cliff could probably be mitigated by a house-ruling a bonus to the save... maybe one-half monster level? I haven't gotten a chance to DM 4e to I'm not as boned up on the math as I could be (I haven't even played epic yet), but the bonus should probably outstrip the PC's abilities to impose penalties to saves.

As for the teleporting the winged mount question, I would also agree that the rider should get a save to go with the mount, and might even lean towards granting a similar save on the ground. Falling prone and losing your mount essentially amounts to losing a round (one move to stand, at least one more to get back on the mount)... that seems a bit more critical in the long run than ~15 damage.