Forked Thread: [Ryan Dancey's D&D Death Spiral] - D&D doomed to cult status?

[Hereticus]

Post removed. I don't particularly care whether you love 4e or hate it, but you need to stop threadcrapping. ~ Piratecat

 

[Remathilis]

I hate Vista, I hate Office 07, and I hate 4.0E.

and I hate New Coke, a Crystal Pepsi, and the new VW Beetle, and...

 

[Mallus]

That is what 4.0E is all about.

My group uses it to create characters marked by, in the words of one of the players, "insane philosophy, transgressive attitudes, and brutal violence" and to tell stories that are best described as "heartbreaking works of staggering, batsh*t genius"...

... ie 4e is all about role-playing to us.

 

[Hussar]

D&D is like Microsoft...

Instead of making minor fixes to what was working pretty well, they went and broke it anew, and we have something much worse.

I hate Vista, I hate Office 07, and I hate 4.0E.

Hereticus, I mean as a friendly bit of advice from someone who has fought too many edition wars over the years.

Stop. Think about what you are saying. Realize that while you truly hold this opinion, that is exactly what it is. An opinion. Stating your opinion like this will only annoy the crap out of people. Trust me on this one. I annoy the crap out of lots people.

It's perfectly fine to not like the game. But, just as you do not see 4e players repeatedly stating why they don't like 3e, you do not gain anything by shouting from the rooftops why you don't like 4e. It is your god given right to hate whatever game you want to hate. But, for the sake of keeping everyone happy, try to phrase your opinion in a slightly less antagonistic way.

-------------------

Back to the topic at hand.

Anecdote is a pretty bad guide really. If I go by my own anecdotes, gamers have all been between 16-30 for my entire life. Yup, there's been the odd exception, but, for the most part, from when I started in 1980 to present, the age of the people I play with and talk to hasn't changed all that much.

As far as having a basic set goes, let's not forget a few things here. The basic set way back when gave you three levels, seven classes and pretty much ZERO options. I really don't think that sort of game will sell very well anymore. And, I'm pretty sure that trying to hook people into the hobby with D&D is the wrong way to go.

There are just so many other options now. Mini's games, CCG's, various board games that blur the line between traditional games and RPG's like the Eurogames. All of these are excellent ways to lure in new gamers. Luring in new gamers with D&D isn't the way to go IMO.

 

[Beginning of the End]

I own H1. It's a pay-to-preview product: It contains no character creation rules, no resources for creating additional adventures, and tells you on paragraph 2 of page 1 to go buy the full game if you want to play more than a single adventure.

There's no shame in that: H1 was specifically designed to preview the new edition and it did a very good job of that.

It's nothing of the sort. It's a D&D adventure that doesn't require a PHB, DMG, or MM to play. That doesn't make it a Starter or Basic set, but it does make it a bargain.

Congratulations, you win the Biggest Non Sequitur of the Day award!

Did you even read the post you were pretending to reply to?

 

[Mallus]

There were not "whole shelves of supplemental material" published for Metamorphosis Alpha (32 pp.)!

Well of course not. Metamorphosis Alpha was never very popular.

The amount published for almost any game (even older D&D and Traveller) is pretty small next to the deluge from 2nd. ed. AD&D on.

My point was that even in the early days of the hobby gamers displayed a healthy appetite for supplemental material. They weren't satisfied with their 32 page booklets.

Moreover, the bulk (apart from magazine articles)...

Not to mention there was an entire magazine devoted to supplemental material for (primarily) D&D.

At least in my experience, most folks spent more on new games (usually with different subject matter) than on complicating those already in their collections.

My experience differs.

 

[Ariosto]

D&D - History and Growth [Corrected & Reposted]

 

[wedgeski]

Congratulations, you win the Biggest Non Sequitur of the Day award!

Did you even read the post you were pretending to reply to?

Poster A suggests that H1 is akin to a starter set.

Poster B (that's you) retorts with the phrase "It's a pay-per-preview product".

Poster C (that's me) takes exception to that turn of phrase.