Full attack action incorporating ranged and melee attacks

[Belares]

You can take a 5' step before, during, or after a full round attack. So the answer is yes, you can.

I was unaware of this rule. I knew before or after but not during.With that said then yes I guess i would concede you can attack 1 opponent then move 5' and attack another.

I still think you should only be able to full attack with ranged or melee, but with that rule then I see the idea behind being able to do both.

 

[Hypersmurf]

You can use two-weapon fighting with ranged weapons if you want to.

Careful - that's actually incorrect.

You can get an extra ranged attack by Attacking With Two Weapons, but you cannot reduce the penalties on your ranged attacks with the Two-Weapon Fighting Feat.

Two-Weapon Fighting is the name of the feat. Attacking With Two Weapons is something anyone can do as part of a full attack action.

Just to confuse the issue, the penalties for Attacking With Two Weapons are called Two-Weapon Fighting penalties

-Hyp.

 

[two]

Auggh! Brain implosion!!! PWEEEE!!!

Let me please beg of somebody for details...math stuff.. urgh!

I am a 1st level human fighter with Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, and Quickdraw.

I am face-to-face with an Ork (melee range).

My strength is 14, my dex. 14. I hold a dagger in each hand.

Round starts. I get initiative.

I swing my main hand with the dagger.
Then I swing my off hand with the second dagger.
Then I take a 5' step back and throw a dagger.

What are my bonuses to hit from each of the three (3) attacks?

Anyone...pretty please? Save a frying brain, someone!

 

[Pielorinho]

My understanding is that you can do this but that, under the best of circumstances, each attack will suffer a -4 penalty.

Rapid shot imposes a -2 penalty on every attack you take this round -- not just every ranged attack.

And under the best of circumstances, fighting with two weapons gives you a -2 penalty on weapons wielded in each hand.

It's probably not worth doing, but I think you could do it.
Daniel

 

[Hypersmurf]

And under the best of circumstances, fighting with two weapons gives you a -2 penalty on weapons wielded in each hand.

The thrown dagger is not "under the best of circumstances", either. Even if he had the Two Weapon Fighting feat - which he doesn't - it wouldn't reduce the penalty on his thrown dagger.

I am a 1st level human fighter with Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, and Quickdraw.

I am face-to-face with an Ork (melee range).

My strength is 14, my dex. 14. I hold a dagger in each hand.

Round starts. I get initiative.

I swing my main hand with the dagger.
Then I swing my off hand with the second dagger.
Then I take a 5' step back and throw a dagger.

What are my bonuses to hit from each of the three (3) attacks?

Okay.

Your BAB is +1, your Dex and Str bonuses are both +2. So your attack bonus is +3 for both melee and ranged.

However, you're using two weapons, with no feats. That's a -6 penalty with your primary hand, and a -10 penalty with your off hand.

Your off hand weapon is light, so those penalties are reduced by 2. But you're using Rapid Shot, so there's another -2 on every attack.

Your primary melee attack, therefore, totals up to -3. Your off hand melee attack totals -7. Your ranged attack is either -3 or -7, depending on which hand you throw with.

On the other hand, if you were a human Ranger with Point Blank Shot and Rapid Shot, plus the Ranger Ambidexterity and Two-Weapon Fighting virtual feats, and the same Str and Dex scores, you would be at :

-1 primary melee.
-1 off-hand melee.
-3 thrown dagger (either hand).

TWF and Ambi make a big difference.

-Hyp.

 

[two]

gnarly dude

thanks for the math breakdown.

So why don't more people grab quickdraw/rapid shot at lower levels, and get a free extra attack?

Sure, you have to use a less-than-optimal weapon, but hey. So what.

I'm thinking... Trident warrior. Hit bad guy with trident, step back 5', get rapid shot extra ranged attack then pull another trident out of your sack using quickdraw. Both attacks at -2 for rapid shot, but both get full strength bonus. It's like a monk's flurry, but more fun!

Or do the handaxe thing; hit a guy (you can use a shield too, no problem), step back, launch it, quickdraw a new one. Everyone attacks twice! Easy!

Makes me thing of abusive things to do as well; if you are in the right position, could you rapid shot, move 5', attack with your melee weapon using expertise/fighting defensively? Sure, you miss with the melee attack, but the penalties don't apply to the ranged attack which already hit. Etc. Odd. Must think more.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Re: gnarly dude

I'm thinking... Trident warrior. Hit bad guy with trident, step back 5', get rapid shot extra ranged attack then pull another trident out of your sack using quickdraw.

How many six-foot-long tridents were you planning on carrying around?

Makes me thing of abusive things to do as well; if you are in the right position, could you rapid shot, move 5', attack with your melee weapon using expertise/fighting defensively? Sure, you miss with the melee attack, but the penalties don't apply to the ranged attack which already hit.

Doesn't work unless you're hasted - you declare Expertise and Fighting Defensively at the start of an attack action, not for a particular attack. Throw-and-stab is a single Full Attack Action - you have to declare before the throw.

-Hyp.

 

[two]

durn. rules.

oh well. But yeah, hey. I dunno. A nice quiver of tridents. Makes for a good image.

Big guy. Full white beard. Barnacles adhearing to his armor. Seaweed skirt. Coral necklace. Shell horn attached firmly to belt - belt made of plaited sargasso. Curses in a manner distinctly... salty. Like the tide, ebbs and flows into direct combat, making 5' steps in and out of melee/ranged combat while pulling and throwing trident after trident... yeah sure, why not? Works for me!

Plus, he can chew on dried whale meat between battles, and as a treat slurp still-squirming oysters from their iridescent shells.

 

[Dr_Rictus]

You can get an extra ranged attack by Attacking With Two Weapons, but you cannot reduce the penalties on your ranged attacks with the Two-Weapon Fighting Feat.

I wasn't talking about the Two-Weapon Fighting feat. I was talking about the two-weapon fighting combat modifiers. Note the lack of capitals.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Two-Weapon Fighting Penalties has capital letters as well

-Hyp.