Game book pricing

[Corinth]

That would be a damn good start.

 

[philreed]

You make it sound like they need to pass some sort of GAMA-sanctioned exam in order to be certified game publishers.

That would sure make a funny PDF.

 

[ColonelHardisson]

Generally, it's not the consumers duty to inform themselves of production cost. It could be very expensive and in the end, still be more than a consumer is willing to pay, despite being 'fairly' priced (all things objective.) The market works as the market works.

Exactly. I don't see how my knowing how much paper is, or how much a printer charges, should affect how I make my choices when buying a game product. I don't break down production costs for just about anything else I buy; why should I do so for games? I simply determine whether the price is within my budget, and if my potential enjoyment of the game book I'm looking at is greater than the enjoyment I could get out of something else I could buy for the same amount of money. That's pretty much all a consumer is required to do, and we all do it almost unconsciously.

 

[Ranger REG]

While I get far more enjoyment out of books, the entire concept is different between books and video games...

Yeah. Books last longer than one version of a videogame title.

 

[diaglo]

AD&D1 Player's Handbook (circa 1980) = 128 pages, hardback = $12

AD&D1 White Plume Mountain (circa 1980) = 16 pages = $4.50

Quasqueton

actually i paid $10 for the PHB (circa 1978)

and $5 for S2 White Plume Mountain

 

[Belen]

But I'm not talking about this from the stance of a writer, now. Speaking simply as a fan: I don't want the RPG industry to die. And it bothers me when people complain about the books costing too much and the RPG companies being money-grubbing corporate entities. Sure, they're out to make a profit; it's called business. But nobody's getting screwed here; in fact, we've all been treated remarkably well, cost-wise.

None of us wants the industry to die, nor do I think it will happen. I do not think the Wizards is in any trouble, although I can see that a lot of other publishers may be. The industry was never designed to accept so many publishers. That is what's killing it. Too many products and not enough money.

The RPG industry has to compete against computer/console games as a source for people's time. Therefore, the books really need to be cheaper than those game. Most kids, not having experienced RPGs, will opt for the latest computer game, unless that RPG book can attract them with a lower price.

Let's face it. The industry is doomed without an influx of new players. The d20 industry does not cater to new players. The only companies that offer entry level products are WOTC and WW. The d20 industry, as a whole, only caters to experienced players, such as the folks on ENWorld. Heck, the print runs are too small for the general public anyway.

 

[Ranger REG]

None of us wants the industry to die, nor do I think it will happen. I do not think the Wizards is in any trouble, although I can see that a lot of other publishers may be. The industry was never designed to accept so many publishers. That is what's killing it. Too many products and not enough money.

Perhaps, but it's not like you can draw lottery as to which publishers can continue to publish for the RPG industry and which can't. They all have to take their chance, and whoever is touch with MOST of the customers -- as well as go out of their way to get them by way of their marketing skills -- get to live another day. The others are just weaned out.

Like all industries, some win and some lose. The only difference is the size of our customer pool (apparently not many when compared to TGC customers; crap).

The RPG industry has to compete against computer/console games as a source for people's time. Therefore, the books really need to be cheaper than those game. Most kids, not having experienced RPGs, will opt for the latest computer game, unless that RPG book can attract them with a lower price.

It's not that. Most books are about the same price as games, but videogames operate with limited use of brainpower. Videogames already come with a setting and a lengthy campaign full of mini-adventures that leads you (or "railroading" you) to one grand epic adventure.

Let's face it. The industry is doomed without an influx of new players. The d20 industry does not cater to new players. The only companies that offer entry level products are WOTC and WW. The d20 industry, as a whole, only caters to experienced players, such as the folks on ENWorld. Heck, the print runs are too small for the general public anyway.

True. For small print presses, they serve a niche in the d20 market. If their businesses are okay catering just a small customer base and build their operation budget around that, then they should be fine.

As for entry-level games, well, we do have Troll Lord Games publishing Castles & Crusades. But what we really need is entry-level support. And that's where "plug-n-play" adventures modules should come in. It's one thing to introduce the game, now you must continue to feed their interests until they advance from a casual gamer all the way up to a lifestyle gamer.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Let's face it. The industry is doomed without an influx of new players. The d20 industry does not cater to new players. The only companies that offer entry level products are WOTC and WW. The d20 industry, as a whole, only caters to experienced players, such as the folks on ENWorld. Heck, the print runs are too small for the general public anyway.

Absolutely. No argument at all from me.

The problem is that most RPG companies simply aren't in a position to attract those customers.

Printing entry-level games isn't enough. Getting licenses that people outside RPGs might be drawn to isn't enough. Both of these may draw in a few new players, but it won't be in sufficient numbers to revitalize the industry.

How do you attract truly new players, then? You advertise, and you do so outside traditional RPG media. You make your products available in toy stores, as the old boxed sets used to be. You put out related products, such as comics, toys, and console games. You advertise more. If you really want to be successful, you find a way to get a related cartoon on the air on Saturday mornings. And you advertise more.

There's not an independent RPG company in the world that can afford what it would truly require to revitalize the industry. I don't believe even WotC could, if it weren't part of Hasbro. The problem is, I've seen no indication that Hasbro wants to spend the money to do so. Why throw resources at trying to expand what is, essentially, a tiny niche market, when it's more profitable (at least in the short run) to jump on pre-existing fads like CCGs?

I'm not sure what the solution is, honestly. Either a gamer has to rise to a position of real influence at Hasbro, or some other game company needs to find an enormous source of money elsewhere that they're willing to funnel into RPG-related products. Until one or the other occurs--or some other miracle I haven't thought of--the market will continue to stagnate, if not shrink outright.

 

[Arnwyn]

Frankly, and I hate to be so blunt about it, but I think people need to get used to the idea that, in the not-too-distant future, they're going to be faced with a simple binary choice.

Accept books that cost a lot more than they do today, or get used to companies either going out of business or putting out books with much lower production values (which ultimately amounts to going out of business, just slower.)

*shrug* Whichever. The neat thing about this is that the market will sort itself out in the end - 'cause that's what markets do. And it will be the result of consumer decisions. Consumers are in no way obligated to pay for anything that they find too expensive/not worth it for themselves.

Cool, huh?

 

[Mouseferatu]

*shrug* Whichever. The neat thing about this is that the market will sort itself out in the end - 'cause that's what markets do. And it will be the result of consumer decisions. Consumers are in no way obligated to pay for anything that they find too expensive/not worth it for themselves.

Cool, huh?

Sure, nobody's obligated to pay for anything they don't want.

I just hope it doesn't result in the collapse of the market entirely, which--given its size--is actually possible. (Not saying probable, but certainly possible.)