Game Mechanics And Player Agency

The concept of player agency is a central pillar of all role-playing games. It is a balancing factor against the omnipotent, omniscient Game Master. For the purposes of this article, we will be focusing on the smaller-scale application of player agency and the role of game mechanics that negate or modify such agency.
The concept of player agency is a central pillar of all role-playing games. It is a balancing factor against the omnipotent, omniscient Game Master. For the purposes of this article, we will be focusing on the smaller-scale application of player agency and the role of game mechanics that negate or modify such agency.


From the very first iteration of Dungeons & Dragons in 1974, there have been mechanics in place in RPGs to force certain decisions upon players. A classic D&D example is the charm person spell, which allows the spell caster to bring someone under their control and command. (The 1983 D&D Basic Set even includes such a possible outcome in its very first tutorial adventure, in which your hapless Fighter may fall under the sway of Bargle and "decide" to let the outlaw magic-user go free even after murdering your friend Aleena!)

It didn't take long for other RPGs to start experimenting with even greater mechanical methods of limiting player agency. Call of Cthulhu (1981) introduced the Sanity mechanic as a way of tracking the player-characters' mental stress and degeneration in the face of mind-blasting horrors. But the Temporary Insanity rules also dictated that PCs exposed to particularly nasty shocks were no longer necessarily in control of their own actions. The current edition of the game even gives the Call of Cthulhu GM carte blanche to dictate the hapless investigator's fate, having the PC come to their senses hours later having been robbed, beaten, or even institutionalized!

King Arthur Pendragon debuted in 1985 featuring even more radical behavioral mechanics. The game's system of Traits and Passions perfectly mirrors the Arthurian tales, in which normally sensible and virtuous knights and ladies with everything to lose risk it all in the name of love, hatred, vengeance, or petty jealousy. So too are the player-knights of the game driven to foolhardy heroism or destructive madness, quite often against the players' wishes. Indeed, suffering a bout of madness in Pendragon is enough to put a player-knight out of the game sometimes for (quite literally) many game-years on end…and if the player-knight does return, they are apt to have undergone significant trauma reflected in altered statistics.

The legacies of Call of Cthulhu and King Arthur Pendragon have influenced numerous other game designs down to this day, and although the charm person spell is not nearly as all-powerful as it was when first introduced in 1974 ("If the spell is successful it will cause the charmed entity to come completely under the influence of the Magic-User until such time as the 'charm' is dispelled[.]"), it and many other mind-affecting spells and items continue to bedevil D&D adventurers of all types.

Infringing on player agency calls for great care in any circumstance. As alluded to at the top of this article, GMs already have so much power in the game, that to appear to take any away from the players is bound to rankle. This is likely why games developed mechanical means to allow GMs to do so in order to make for a more interesting story without appearing biased or arbitrary. Most players, after all, would refuse to voluntarily submit to the will of an evil wizard, to faint or flee screaming in the presence of cosmic horror, or to attack an ally or lover in a blind rage. Yet these moments are often the most memorable of a campaign, and they are facilitated by behavioral mechanics.

What do you think? What's your personal "red line" for behavioral mechanics? Do behavioral mechanics have any place in RPGs, and if so, to what extent? Most crucially: do they enhance narrative or detract from it?

contributed by David Larkins
 

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There is a lot fisking going on. I do love the idea of only being able to respond to one quote... or to only be allowed to quote up to 5 lines.

I always thought fisking was what Popeye did out on the lake when Olive was getting on his nerves and he needed to get out of the house on a weekend morning. Ag ag ag ag ag!
 
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But, again, that's presuming that we're using 3e mechanics. That wouldn't be a heck of a lot of fun would it? There's a number of other techniques we can look at other than a simple binary pass/fail check. That's a bit of a strawman isn't it?

The whole mechanic does not sound like a heck of a lot of fun. So not sure how much of a strawman it is to describe it happening in play.

Personally, I'm partial to the idea of a sort of skill challenge, or extended skill checks, whatever you want to call them, to come to a conclusion. Could be something as simple as first past the post - whoever can make 5 arguments and 5 skill checks first (perhaps each one opposed, or against a static DC) wins. Or, perhaps a sort of social combat system where you make checks, each success causes X "damage". Take the PC's level vs the NPC's CR and go that way. There's a bunch of options here.

I know that some enjoy the skill challenge system.

Let's be honest, D&D sucks as far as these sorts of mechanics go.

I'm frankly rather baffled by the push back here. There's all sorts of games out there with social mechanics. It's not like this is some bizarre notion out of thin air. Social combat mechanics have been part of RPG's for decades. It's that D&D has remained stubbornly set in the notion that anything that isn't combat should be free formed.

Personally I am not surprised by the push back in that it appears to be trying to replace the Roleplaying part of the game with more game part. I mean we managed to survive decades of play with no roleplay mechanics at all but no harm to trying to tinker with the game especially with PF2 playtest in the works.
 

FATE is not a "niche" game. Classic Traveller is not a "niche" game. Call of Cthulhu is not a "niche" game.

As I said, this is not a thread about D&D. It's a thread about the relationship between social resolution mechanics and player agency. If you won't talk or think about any mechanics but 3E's very poor Diplomacy mechanics, then you're not going to learn much about the thread topic!

It is interesting to see what the Indie game designers are doing. I mean who would have thought about using a Jenga tower as a resolution mechanism.
 

There is a lot fisking going on. I do love the idea of only being able to respond to one quote... or to only be allowed to quote up to 5 lines.

So you say that we should be restricted to only writing 5 lines at a time?

I thought that was what Twitter was for?
 

I've characterized it as a technique, and a powerful one. It can be used to produce desirable or undesirable results, depending on the skill and inclination of the DM employing it.
As you know, I very strongly dislike "low player agency" RPGing (what I would call railroading). But you'll get no argument from me that it is very common, widely advocated in RPG rulebooks (see eg 2nd ed AD&D for one highwatermark), and appears to be very popular.

So, no creativity, no interest, no imagination, no character portrayal?
And clearly this is what a lot of RPGers seem to have in mind when they talk about playing a game or playing their character. It is all quite compatible with having no agency in respect of the trajectory of play and the shared fiction.

An exception to my previous paragraph: in my experience playing CoC is all about this sort of creativity and character portrayal, and in modest doses it's quite fun.
 
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I mean we managed to survive decades of play with no roleplay mechanics at all but no harm to trying to tinker with the game especially with PF2 playtest in the works.
D&D has "reaction roll" mechanics in all its classic versions. (I don't know if 2nd ed AD&D or 3E have them. 4e doesn't.)

Gygax's DMG expands the reaction roll mechanics into a rather intricate system for morale and loyalty.

Classic Traveller (1977) has reaction roll mechanics, and it has morale mechanics that apply to PCs as much as NPCs.

Various sorts of social mechanics, including player-facing ones, are as old as RPGing.
 

One of the core examples thru this thread has bern does the duke convince your character to take the mission". If you say you have not sern anyone here who was for social mechanics workong on pcs who was also for that being possible, i am not gonna go back and ferret them out for you.
Well, I'm not goint to go back and ferret them out either.
[MENTION=22779]Hussar[/MENTION] hasn't embraced the example. I already pointed to the most developed concrete proposal in this thread for incorporating social considerations in to 5e by way of Inspiration & Ideals/Bonds/Flaws. I've pointed to other RPGs which have working social resolution systems.

I just don't see the point of arguing against a position that has no serious advocates in its favour.
 

D&D has "reaction roll" mechanics in all its classic versions. (I don't know if 2nd ed AD&D or 3E have them. 4e doesn't.)

Gygax's DMG expands the reaction roll mechanics into a rather intricate system for morale and loyalty.

Classic Traveller (1977) has reaction roll mechanics, and it has morale mechanics that apply to PCs as much as NPCs.

Various sorts of social mechanics, including player-facing ones, are as old as RPGing.

Reaction mechanics are a far different beast then what you are proposing and, if anything, simply state the initial conditions of the encounter rather then dictating what is going to happen. And I understand the Loyalty and Morale mechanics never applied to PCs only to NPCs or at least I never experienced having a character that needed to make a Morale roll.

I believe that Traveller has mechanics which can result in your character dying during character creation as well. Is that something that we also need to have in DnD?
 

I believe that Traveller has mechanics which can result in your character dying during character creation as well. Is that something that we also need to have in DnD?
I didn't think this was a D&D thread - it's in General RPG, after all. I though it was a thread about how social mechanics of varous sorts relate to player agency (whcih presumably also has various manifestations).

Reaction mechanics are a far different beast then what you are proposing and, if anything, simply state the initial conditions of the encounter rather then dictating what is going to happen.
Classic Traveller has the following rule in relation to encounter rolls (Book 3, p 23):

Reactions are used by the referee and by players as a guide to the probable actions of individuals. . . Reactions govern the reliability and quality of hirelings and employees. Generally, they would re-roll reactions in the face of extremeley bad treatment of unusually dangerous tasks.​

In the example of play in Moldvay Basic (p B28), the PCs meet some hobgoblins and the GM makes a reaction roll. This is modified by a player's declared action for his/her PC ("The DM decided that Silverleaf's open hands and words in the hobgoblins' language are worth +1 when checking for reaction"). As negotiations unfold, "The DM rolls a new reaction with no adjustments."

I have used that same technique in my Traveller GMing - ie rolling a new reaction, with appropriate modifiers (if any), to determine how NPCs respond in unfolding conversation or negotiation. I think it is consistent with the spirit of the rules presented on p 23 of Book 3.

And this is clearly not just setting starting conditions. It is a way of determining what happens, and is affected by player action declarations. When I GM Traveller, I actually have the players roll the reaction dice, which seems more "contemporary" in feel: it's analogous to a Diplomacy check in 4e, or a Leadership or Seduction or other influence check in Rolemaster.
 
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I didn't think this was a D&D thread - it's in General RPG, after all. I though it was a thread about how social mechanics of varous sorts relate to player agency (whcih presumably also has various manifestations).

That does not answer the question of whether we should include Traveler style Character creation mechanics into DnD though does it?
 

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