Game of Thrones or Black Company description?

[JoeGKushner]

Ultimately, the feeling of XX's world is not 100% compatible with standard D&D. I would hardly even call it 10% compatible... There are few monsters. Characters achieve status situationally, rather than through some experience grind. Combat, even for highly experienced characters, is deadly. Perhaps the second most powerful character in the book, physical attribute-wise, is felled by infection from a minor wound.

Does this sound like something from Game of Thrones, Black Company or applicable to either setting?

Over on RPG.net, I'm getting into a psuedo arugement with someone about the 'feel' of Game of Thrones and how it couldn't be modelled with standard d20 style characters despite the fact that Black Company, Grim Tales and others are able to do exactly that and remain almost 100% compatible with D&D, which Game of Thrones, based on previews thus far, does not seem to acheive.

By compatible, I mean I can take a scout from Black Company, put him in a Forgotten Realms campaign. I can take a Jack of All Trades, a non-arms, non-spelluser, and put him in a Greyhawk campaign. I don't have to tweak their hit dice. I don't have to mess with their skill points. I don't have to mess with their special abilities.

Opinions?

 

[jester47]

All I can say is I disagree with the person you are quoting. Character power level is not to be confused with political power level. You can be a very powerful wizard and still have no official say in the government of a big city. Until you are crowned King, you are still just some guy thats really good at killing lots of orcs. Just because someone is in charge and does cool things in combat, it does not necessarily make him high level.

Aaron.

 

[Rodrigo Istalindir]

Ultimately, the feeling of XX's world is not 100% compatible with standard D&D. I would hardly even call it 10% compatible... There are few monsters. Characters achieve status situationally, rather than through some experience grind. Combat, even for highly experienced characters, is deadly. Perhaps the second most powerful character in the book, physical attribute-wise, is felled by infection from a minor wound.

Doing away with hit points in favor of some sort of WP/VP system is the only systemic change, necessary, I think. Fortitude DCs for disease can escalate at the DMs disrection. XP can be awarded based on accomplishment rather than by killing critters, and it is quite possible to run D&D where the vast majority of encounters are against other humans.

The magic system can be the other major stumbling block, although between psions (spell points), sorcerers (spontaneous), wizards (traditional prep) and warlocks (at will), I think pretty much any setting could be accomodated with little more than fiddling with spell lists.

 

[Krieg]

Does this sound like something from Game of Thrones, Black Company or applicable to either setting?

To be honest, it sounds like something that someone with an axe to grind against D20 would say about just any setting that he was particularly enamoured with.

 

[WizarDru]

Ultimately, the feeling of XX's world is not 100% compatible with standard D&D. I would hardly even call it 10% compatible... There are few monsters. Characters achieve status situationally, rather than through some experience grind. Combat, even for highly experienced characters, is deadly. Perhaps the second most powerful character in the book, physical attribute-wise, is felled by infection from a minor wound.

Does this sound like something from Game of Thrones, Black Company or applicable to either setting?

Over on RPG.net, I'm getting into a psuedo arugement with someone about the 'feel' of Game of Thrones and how it couldn't be modelled with standard d20 style characters despite the fact that Black Company, Grim Tales and others are able to do exactly that and remain almost 100% compatible with D&D, which Game of Thrones, based on previews thus far, does not seem to acheive.

Opinions?

Game of Thrones and Black Company both have characters who are extremely powerful individually, but not powerful politically. Look at the Cleganes, for example, in GoT: the aptly named "Mountain" is extremely powerful and dangerous: but he still follows the orders of his leige lord, and doesn't even have a large parcel of land or wealth, as far as we know. The same applies for Jamie Lannister, unquestionably one of the most accomplished knights of the day, but little more than a weapon until he gains political power. Conversely, his brother Tyrion the Imp has virtually no physical threat, but has lots of political clout (or wealth, at points).

If you use primarily NPC classes, you represent GoT just fine. The removal of most magic items means that poisons and diseases will always be a threat, and everyone sleeps sometimes.

 

[JoeGKushner]

http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?t=173658

Just for those who want to see what started that ball rolling.

 

[Steel_Wind]

The Black Company is a great campaign setting, but to call it 100% compaitble with D&D is nonsense.

The healing system and magic system as presented by Green Ronin have been utterly changed so much so that they are no longer recognizably D&D.

I am not saying their work is bad; on the contrary, I think it's great. But the premise you are arguing could be assisted greatly by being a wee less bullish on the Black Company's "D&D compatibility".

If the premise is :The Black Company could be done in D20; so too can GoT - then I agree. Seeing as the GoT hardcover is due out "soon" I guess we'll see shortly.

 

[JoeGKushner]

Well Steel, as you note, the chances are involved in healing and the magic system.

You can pretty much drop the characters from Black Company into any other setting though.

From what I've seen of Game of Thrones though, that doesn't appear to be the case.

For many, that's fine. B5 and Spycraft for example, are both d20 games but can't be used in d20 Modern for example.

Me? After seeing how Black Company puts all the changes not on the characters but on the various dials and background elements, I'm much more in the camp that if you're going to do a d20 adaptation, do it or go OGL.

 

[Burke]

I'm a big fan of ASOIAF, but I'm not familar with the Black Company or Grim Tales RPGs, and I haven't particulary been following the development of the Game of Thrones RPG, so I'm not clear on all the details of the discussion, or what has been done. Having said that, I'd think a RPG would need the following to "be true to" A Game of Thrones:

Very few monsters (there are a few things that could be considered monsters in Westeros, but not many).

Little to no magic items (this alone would make it difficult to drop a mid or higher level character into a standard D&D game, unless he was given lots of items).

Reworked magic system, with very few spell casters, very limited spells, and no healing magic (other than a very imperfect form of raise dead). Also, a ritualistic aspect to spell casting where something is paid for the spell's power (e.g. what Melisandre or Miri Maaz Dur (sp?) does).

Permenant wound system, i.e. the ability to lose a limb which would have a permenant effect on a character. And also probably a location hit system.

Melee combat that is just in general deadlier than normal D&D combat (once you remove all the save or die effects).

Battle fatigue system, where a character takes penalties as a fight contiues, especially based upon what type of armor they're wearing. Think Bronn versus the knight of the Eyre, or Gregore Clegane's fight in A Storm of Swords.

Character system where advancement in skill or followers is not tied to hp gains. For instance, a 10th level expert should lose to a 1st level warrior most of the time.

 

[ecliptic]

D20 is only a system and if it is d20 that means that it goes by the guidelines set by Wizards of the Coast,