Satin Knights
First Post
I waffled on a) enough that I switched back to using it for my own character. So, at least one of us will be using it.
General Discussion
- Thread starter Qik
- Start date
perrinmiller
Adventurer
After some thought, I am calling into question something that has occurred in the Arcane Row.
I want enchant Borric's weapon. So I rolled the dice and succeeded on the 75% check. But it would appear that I cannot do that, needing to treat it as crafting and wait 18 days RL to cover the 6000gp. Why must it be crafting only?
If I roll and make it, why not treat it as regular crafting IC; 8hrs per 1000gp which is 6 days IC. With a DM cooperating, this might be hand waved. In between adventures, no waiting required.
On another note, the spending limit for Venza is 8000gp. This is going to be hampering as some characters start getting to 7-8+ levels.
I want enchant Borric's weapon. So I rolled the dice and succeeded on the 75% check. But it would appear that I cannot do that, needing to treat it as crafting and wait 18 days RL to cover the 6000gp. Why must it be crafting only?
If I roll and make it, why not treat it as regular crafting IC; 8hrs per 1000gp which is 6 days IC. With a DM cooperating, this might be hand waved. In between adventures, no waiting required.
On another note, the spending limit for Venza is 8000gp. This is going to be hampering as some characters start getting to 7-8+ levels.
Maidhc O Casain
Na Bith Mo Riocht Tá!
It's crafting because it is crafting . . . the roll is to see if the Row has an item for which you are looking in stock. You're asking them to take an existing weapon and craft an enchantment into it.
Could you not simply purchase the weapon you want? Since you made the check, the Row will have it in stock.
Could you not simply purchase the weapon you want? Since you made the check, the Row will have it in stock.
Buying the item with all enchantments from scratch puts the value of the item over 8000 gold, which was, I believe, why SK ruled it had to be commissioned.
In the absence of the city limit, though, I will say it seems a bit odd to me that there needs to be a mechanical difference between saying "I turn this thing in and get the exact same thing plus extras" and saying "add the extras." Especially since the general description of an item is, I believe, up to a PC. So she or he can even say they bought something with the exact same unique scrollwork pattern or whatever. At that point, it *does* seem silly to force the person to wait longer if he or she wants to fluff the upgrade in a more realistic context (upgrading an item) than a clearly contrived one ("I found something that looks identical to what I have, has the same base enchantments, and then has extra ones"). So long as there's still an availability roll at stake, I'm not sure what the benefit is of forcing the latter.
GlassEye
Adventurer
I agree with Mowgli. The 75% chance is to pull an item off the shelf and purchase it, not add enchantments to something that already exists. Doesn't matter if the cost of the enchantment is less than the community base value, adding enchantments still works like commissioning.
Mowgli, I think the item in question is a +2 magical weapon (equivalent); cost 8,3xx gp, just over the base value and not subject to the 75% availability rule. This will end up being more hindering to those characters who reach higher levels before the majority of the other characters but I don't think we should change it.
Mowgli, I think the item in question is a +2 magical weapon (equivalent); cost 8,3xx gp, just over the base value and not subject to the 75% availability rule. This will end up being more hindering to those characters who reach higher levels before the majority of the other characters but I don't think we should change it.
Qik
First Post
Just out of curiosity, has there been any planning/discussion for what to do in, say, six months to a year when PCs with enough cash to regularly buy over the 8000 gp limit are much more prevalent?
Maidhc O Casain
Na Bith Mo Riocht Tá!
I think for me a lot of this 're-fluffing on the fly' stuff has become a matter of verisimilitude and/or immersion. "Don't see a deity that gives your cleric the favored wapon you want, or the domains you want? No problem, just make one up! Can't get exactly the combination of trait benefits you want? Just throw together a new trait, re-categorize it, and there you go!"
When we started this a couple of years ago, we set out to be very careful to make sure everything fit the world we'd conceived, and proposals were very carefully scrutinized, debated, edited and resubmitted. We also set a precedent of keeping as much of the official Paizo published Pathfinder Rules as Written as we could.
We hashed out the rules for the Pearl back then, and tried to get a system that would both provide folks what they wanted and keep as much of a lid on the "Christmas Tree" magic item effect as we could within the scope of the rules. We didn't allow PCs to craft items, because that would play merry hell with the wealth by level mechanic. I honestly can't remember whether or not I voted for reselling items at 100% value; I know the reason (it makes bookkeeping a LOT easier) but I now find myself regretting the other unintended effects (there is no "saving your money" now, and no thinking ahead when making item purchase in case there's something else you want to spend your money on later; and just how, exactly, does the Pearl make any money?). It's another example of a written mechanic being thrown out for convenience, with unintended results that - for me, at least - are jarring every time I run upon them.
By RAW, crafting does take time. I just don't want this to become another written mechanic that gets thrown out for the sake of convenience - especially when the inconvenience is simply a matter of waiting a few days.
And finally, for the inconvenience of waiting a few days, you get a 100% chance of getting exactly what you want!
Artur Hawkwing
First Post
Even disregarding the minute over the 8k limit issue, you have to assume there aren't an army of wizards and mages who just sit around merrily doing nothing but enchanting item after item all day. There might be a delay, even if you provide the item, lets say a weapon, to be enchanted. First it must be cleaned up so that the mage/wizard can handle it. Then, if any special materials (fluffzilla!) are required, there must be time to gather those together. Then the weapon must be prepared (it must be at least marinated overnight) before the Mage can begin to pour their own money, time, spell and, if needed, XP into the item. Perhaps they need a couple of days to earn enough XP to count for an XP cost, as if a PC were enchanting/crafting the item? In a real world sort of application, it makes sense. Unless you want the McDonald's Big Mac Sword of Special Sauce +2, you have to be patient and have the work done right.
That makes sense to me, anywho.
That makes sense to me, anywho.
Qik
First Post
Thanks for the thoughts, mfloyd! Definitely some food for thought.
At this point, I feel like I'm nearing the point where I just need to jump, and make a decision; a bit of waffling is natural, but after a point, I start to feel like any decision is better than trying to make "the right one." It's almost a shame that the answer to so many of these decisions only comes after playing the PC for a few months!
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