Getting players to Move

[Kugar]

Tell them what the consequences probably are.

At some point in the "Decision log jam" you are not having fun. When you get bored with the "witty" in character resolution, wait a little - then ask for a decision. Do so with a rumbling of the earth and a gathering of clouds if need be. Then if they still look at you with confused eyes take a break and recap all the highlights as you see them that relate to the decision at hand. Usually that makes the decision clear. Usually the cause of delay is the "ultimately subtle clue" that really is just confusing or forgot.

If they still have Deer in the Headlight eyes then spell out the consequences and make them choose (remember to include doing nothing) This is a game, and if the fun is suffering then accommodations must be made.

 

[Furn_Darkside]

Heh, I just thought of something I would use for this type of situation during 2nd edition. I have not had need to bring this back, yet..

I made it clear, ooc, that whatever was going on was unacceptable and hurting the gaming of that day. If it did not stop, then I would inflict the zero rule.

I would add a zero to the next combat. It may be in the number of opponents- 2 ogres to 20 ogres, it may be in hit points - 50 to 500, or wherever else I felt it was appropriate to put that zero.

I only needed to do it once. Those 100 skeletons proved a sharp memory that if they don't keep the game moving, then I would help them along.

FD

 

[Wicht]

Just for the record, the game was still fun, just they did not accomplish all that I wanted them to accomplish.

They had all the information they needed to make a decision. They are in a room they suspect a demon is buried. They have cleaned out all the monsters, there is no reason for wandering monsters. They have been told (by their god) to leave the demon buried.

In the room they see a sarcophogus and a ruby. The ruby speaks to the ranger and offers him a wish. They have already encountered one other NPC alive in this area. He is currently waiting (invisible) to ambush them (unbeknownst to them) but he has told them to smash the ruby and not under any curcimstances to take it out of the room (and he is unable to enter the room the ruby is in - glyph of warding). The ruby eventually makes it clear it grants 1 wish upon being smashed. The Paladin thinks the demon is in the ruby and therefore wants to leave it in the room. The ranger wants to take the ruby with them so it is not up for grabs. The cleric thinks they should take the ruby and study it. The fighter thinks they should drop it in a spiked pit they passed. The kobold with them says he would just take the wish.

The ranger and the cleric want to take it but they are not so convinced that they will not listen to the paladin. In the meantime they are trying to figure out where the demon is (they ended up with the theory of a body in the sarcaphogus and the soul in the ruby) which is why the ranger thinks they should seperate the two things by as many miles as possible. The NPC mentioned a book in Kalamar that he studied and the cleric wants to take the ruby to the book. The paladin just wants to leave it alone, as he thinks he was told to.

There probably was no real solution for me, as it is an important decision on their part but I did want them to finally leave the temple they were in and find out what had been happening elsewhere.

and now that I have ranted back to writing all this up for my story hour.

 

[Rel]

I tend to present challenges to my players that are pretty harsh for the level of the characters involved. I've developed this set of equations which I've freely shared with the players:

Usually...

Good Planning + Good Luck = A decisive win for the party

Good Planning + Average Luck = A win for the party

Good Planning + Bad Luck = A tough win for the party (depending on how bad the luck is, it is possible - though unlikely- that a character might die)

Bad Planning + Good Luck = A tough win for the party

Bad Planning + Average Luck = Likely a loss forcing a retreat or worse

Bad Planning + Bad Luck = Almost certain defeat. One or more characters will likely die and/or be captured.


As a result, I let them plan for as long as they'd like. If they are going up against a powerful foe in a battle with lots of variables, the planning alone can take over an hour. But that's ok with me. I enjoy hearing the tactics they might employ. I don't use the GM knowledge against them but I sometimes steal ideas for future encounters.

To their credit, they don't usually do this sort of thing in areas where they are likely to be ambushed or stumbled upon by wandering monsters. If they did, there would be consequences.

If it is combat, I try to enforce things moving along by limiting the decision making to ten seconds or less and discouraging table talk.

 

[Cloudgatherer]

How many players are there? The more players, the more dialog and debate.

Ran a one shot where my sidekick (a PC) only spoke to me, didn't like talking to other people. Since there was only the two of us, I got to decide everything. That went really fast .

Hey, we won they day, so I must have been doing something right (heh, it was an epic game, so I used foresight the entire time....)

 

[Fast Learner]

Time Passes

Even without any chance of wandering monsters, I always make it very clear that time is passing, something that starts to worry them and eventually gets them to act.

I try to use in-game clues, though, like:

"There's a tiny spider climbing up the wall."
"The spider is almost up at the ceiling, now."
"The spider is has dropped down from the ceiling, leaving a small bit of web behind."
"The spider is climbing up..."

By this point the spider is usually dead, so I move to something like:

"The small trickle of water on the floor slows and stops flowing."
"The trickle starts back up again."
"A small bug is washed down the trickle."

Etc. Now it only takes about two such sentences before they make a decision and move on.

 

[Vymair]

Sounds like you DM my group

First, it's their time. If they want to spend it cussing and discussing, I rarely interfere (unless of course, they are arguing loudly in a room next to a monster..). I figure less preparation for me the next session since this session's material will carry over..

Howver, if they are stalling in game time (letting weeks pass while they discuss a problem) that is much easier to solve. My campaign has many plot threads running and my players have learned that unresolved threads grow more difficult as time goes along.

For example, my players decided not to investigate a report of some Formians active in the kingdom about 18 months ago in game time (about a year ago in our time) and lo and behold, the Formians used the planar gate they had discovered to bring across a queen and form a hive. Needless to say, resolution of that problem was much tougher than it could have been had they acted immediately... (in their defense, they spent that time resolving some pretty big problems with a reborn lich and the discovery of githyanki activity)...

PirateCat refers to this as the ripple theory and periodically, my players throws some pretty big rocks in the pond...

 

[Fast Learner]

First, it's their time. If they want to spend it cussing and discussing, I rarely interfere (unless of course, they are arguing loudly in a room next to a monster..). I figure less preparation for me the next session since this session's material will carry over..

LOL! I always think the exact same thing!

 

[Pielorinho]

Wicht, it sounds to me like you gave the players a tough decision with dire consequences for choosing wrongly and with few clues as to what the correct choice is.

Cool!

But I don't understand why, given that setup, you'd expect them to choose quickly. They thought that all the enemies were dead, and their next action would determine whether a demon was unloosed on the world.

Given that setup, I'd expect them to spend a long time talking.

However, if you want to move them along in a case like this, I'd suggest providing more clues. Maybe the ruby shows up to detect evil. Maybe it has overlapping magical auras, which a good spellcraft check can separate into (whatever wish is) and abjuration. Bardic knowledge might recall an old fairy tale with a similar setup. Knowledge: arcana or knowledge: planes might be able to determine whether a ruby would be an effective trap for a demon. A rogue looking at the crypt might realize that those cracks in the stone are actually worn-down hieroglyphs, and might be able to make a decipher script roll.

But this is exactly the sort of situation where wise adventurers will discuss things ad nauseum. Otherwise, there's one more free demon terrorizing the populace.

Daniel

 

[Umbran]

They had all the information they needed to make a decision.

Um, I'm sorry to say, but by your description, they did not have all the information they needed.

What they needed to do was not clear, and not easily derived from the available information. They had to guess. If you leave them having to guess on something important, you'd better expect them to try their best to hash out which is the best guess. And that can take a while.

Moral of the story - don't expect a person to walk quickly through fog.