Give this race a level adjustment...

Eh.
Aside from some odd interactions this would have with children, it's not really overpowered. You don't get aging penalties, but you don't get the bonuses either. You just remain as you are... which doesn't break the game as far as I can tell.


It depends on the source or what Timeless Body looks like.



Monk:
Timeless Body (Ex)

Upon attaining 17th level, a monk no longer takes penalties to her ability scores for aging and cannot be magically aged. Any such penalties that she has already taken, however, remain in place. Bonuses still accrue, and the monk still dies of old age when her time is up.



Psionic Power:

Timeless Body

Psychoportation

Level:Psion/wilder 9Display:MaterialManifesting Time:1 standard actionRange:PersonalTarget:YouDuration:1 roundPower Points:17
Your body ignores all harmful (and helpful) effects, beginning when you finish manifesting this power and ending at the end of your next turn. While timeless body is in effect, you are invulnerable to all attacks and powers.
This power cannot be quickened.


If its related to the Monk's version then they start with very strong mentals, weak physicals and then as they get older their mentals get even stronger but they get no physically weaker. This would put it as a +3 (instead of +2) as it brings it very much in line with Half-Dragon or similiar +3 adjustments I can think of based on ability scores alone.
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Good catch.

Come to think of it, though, children start off with poor physical stats and poor mental stats... so just keeping those and only accruing mental stat bonuses form leveling up... well, let's just say you won't be the smartest member of the guild.
 


I'd lean toward +1 except that the entire package together seems less of a race to me than it does an enhancement package for a particular class or classes. There are only a handful of classes you'd play this race as, and I'd guess there are less than a handful of personalities suggested by the racial archetype.

Several of its powers only work in conjunction with spellcasting classes, but each of them is equivalent to a useful feat enhancing spellcasting. The penalties to strength are almost inconsequential for anything you would be playing, and the penalty to Con is more than negated under point buy by the unbalanced stats that allow you to start with strong charisma without paying a hefty price for it and you can more than overcome the racial penalty by what you save to get there. Likewise, I can't really see under point buy many different arrays of attributes that would actually be purchased.

As a result of the narrow focus and synergistic powers, I'd rate this a +2 LA.
 

One of the issues I have is that it's just... really poorly written. I had a hard time getting a clear idea of what the mechanics of this class are.
 

I was thinking more along the druid (though same as monk i suppose)... once they become adults they cease aging.

Well that's the benefit of making the race, you can choose what it looks like. Based on above I'm assuming you meant for them to accrue the mental stat increases. Both the druid and the monk do.

To my knowledge the reason they don't really add up for the psionic power is because it is basically a magical change not natural.
 

None of the racial abilities strike me as really powerful. Nice? Yes. Powerful, game-breaking, way out there? Nah. That leaves only the racial ability score modifiers to judge by, and when I see a +4 somewhere, I get leery. As Celebrim said, you'd only be playing a Cleric, Sorcerer or Bard and not much else with these guys. So what you get is very good for you, and what you lose doesn't hurt that much.

I'd compare this to a Goliath: you wouldn't want to play a Goliath that isn't focused on melee in some way. Goliaths are just plain fantastic for anything that melees. They're much less useful to play as an arcane caster or something like that, they're pigeonholed very much like this race is. Goliaths, despite being unbalanced where good class/race synergy is concerned, are only LA+1. So I'd put this race at LA+1, as well.
 

I tend to rate things in the similar nature of Flaws.
Something should not be considered against the LA unless it DOES cause problems for the character. Anything that CAN cause problems, based on how the DM runs things, should not be used to balance the powerful features.
For example, the -2 Str and -2 Con reduce the LA.
The vulnerabilities that will rarely come into play under normal circumstances though should be completely disregarded, and not used to justify lowering the LA.
This rule is logical because players will always try to minimize weaknesses and amplify strengths, and because the DM should not be restricted to specific action for a characters weakness to be an actual weakness.
This means that the class has a lot of features that would add to the LA, and very few that would decrease it.

I would personally slot it as a generous and high-end +2, or a more realistic low-end +3.
 

I'd compare this to a Goliath: you wouldn't want to play a Goliath that isn't focused on melee in some way. Goliaths are just plain fantastic for anything that melees. They're much less useful to play as an arcane caster or something like that, they're pigeonholed very much like this race is. Goliaths, despite being unbalanced where good class/race synergy is concerned, are only LA+1. So I'd put this race at LA+1, as well.

The problem with that analysis is that it assumes that the Goliath is fairly priced at LA+1.

Now, of course the problem here is that LA is a very bad tool and a crude one at that. I personally would probably never allow a character with a race of more than LA+1, and hypothetically if I did I'd do some adjustments to how it worked (XP penalties as well as or off setting the level adjustment). So, it's not like I can say with any definitiveness whether something is LA+1 or LA+2 and good arguments can be made either way in most cases. For example, below a certain level for LA+X the character may be less powerful, but above another level the character may be clearly more powerful compared to a LA+0 race.

The problem I have is with the very concept of races like the Goliath. One of the main purposes of a class based system is to prevent the sort of hyperspecialization that tends to dominate point buy games. The goal of a class or a race within a class based system is typically to force on to the player an array of 'useless' benefits that add breadth and balance to the character at the expense of the height of raw power in a single area. So for example, you'll typically see some noob taking a LA+X race and saying, "If I drop [a list of non-synergistic abilities] would that make the race LA+X-1?" And of course it wouldn't. The abilities are typically minor precisely because they don't synergize with each other. They are just somewhat helpful in a variaty of other lesser and unrelated situations. Likewise, you'll see noobs propose some sort of base class which takes all the benefits of some strong class, drops all the minor and sundry benefits of that class, and then replaces them with some very strong ability from another class or a direct enhancement of their primary schtick. So for example, a noob might ask, "Here is my class, it's just like a wizard only it has no BAB progression, no weapon proficiencies, and no bonus feats. In exchange it gets an animal companion and wildshape like a druid. Is that balanced?"

In a point buy system, the answer might be a reluctant 'yes' just because the math adds up. But in a class based system there is no reason to allow such hyperspecialized classes in the first place because they undermine the entire system.

So when someone shows me a race like Goliath, where you get loaded up with awesome melee bling, I'm immediately skeptical.

One way to see exactly why is to look at the one aspect of D&D that is often point buy: attribute scores. Under point buy system, buying up an attribute from 17 to 18 is much more expensive than it is to buy it up from 8 to 9. Why is that? The answer is of course because you get so much more advantage out of being specialized in the thing you are supposed to be good at, that it often completely outweighs being rather bad at things you'll rarely do. Examine with that in mind the Goliath's -2 penalty to Dex. You might suppose that this makes for some sort of handicap to the Goliath PC, but you'd be wrong. To see why, consider the case of the human PC twink with 18 STR and 18 CON. To gain these large bonuses, he must live with an 8 in every other attribute, and depending on the DM he might well be happy to do so.

Now, an Optimizer builds his character with an 18 STR and an 18 CON using a goliath. Having done so, he still has 16 points to spend on abilities! He can therefore start not only with a 12 in INT, CHR, and WIS, but with a 10 in DEX - meaning that despite his handicap of a -2 DEX he actually is more dextrous than the human melee brute. In effect, he's traded the human feat and extra skill for a +4 to INT, +4 to CHR, +4 to Wis, and +2 to DEX. He's more skillful than the human as well as more dexterous, and this before we add in all of sundry minor abilities of the race many of which are also synergistic with the +4 bonus to Strength. Or he might dump CHR as useless, and do +4 to DEX, +4 to Int and +6 to WIS relative to the human character with the same build. And of course the true optimizer might well come up with an even more effective set of attributes melee focused character than the one I suggested, I was just showing how large the potential benefit of that unbalanced stat array could be.

Yes, within the gross adjustment of the rules it might be a long time before the Goliath character truly realized the maximum benifit of his racial template, but I've little doubt he'd get there. On the basis of my experience with point buy systems, it's almost always better to pay the steep rates to be exceptionally good at one thing, than it is to spread around your points. Goliath and the like are examples of using the class system to do that very thing.

So, within the limited options of the rules, I'd prefer +2 LA to both the Goliath and the here suggested race. But honestly, I'd not allow either because mechanically they are class enhancement packages and not races.
 


Pets & Sidekicks

Remove ads

Top