Giving sorcerers additional spells known in return for specific spell selections

[nikolai]

One of the perenial problems with sorcerers is that some spells duplicate the effects of weaker spells: Summon Monster, illusions, etc. So there's a dilemma over taking them, since they become redundant. What does everyone think of this solution?

Grant additional known spells, if particular spell combinations are learnt. So, if a sorcerer knows both Summon Monster II & III, he gets an additional 1st level spell (I can see this going right the way through to the top, so if you know IIX & IX you get a free 7th level spell). This will allow focus on a particular area of spells without weakening the character. Thoughts, both on the idea and the implementation?

 

[XCorvis]

I don't really see how bonus low level spells would balance the tradeoff. It's not really worth it, IMO, and in order to make it worth it, it would probably unbalance the class.

Have you seen the 3.5 solution to this? Sorcerers can "swap out" a known spell for another at every even level. There's another restriction on what level of spell you can swap, but I can't recall it at the moment. I think it solves the problem quite nicely. Just when sleep and summon monster I are no longer effective, you get to ditch them for something more useful.

 

[Telperion]

"Upon reaching 4th level, and at every even-numbered sorcerer level after that (6th, 8th, and so on) a sorcerer can choose to learn a new spell in place of one he already knows. In effect, the sorcerer "loses" the old spell in exchange for the new one. The new spell's level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged, and it must be at least two levels lower than the highest-level sorcerer spell the sorcerer can cast."

It works very nicely . One great example is that you can swap that nearly useless Invisibility to Invisibility, Greater. Unlike wizards, who tend to have just about all the low-level spells in their books the sorcerers really have quite a small selection even to low level spells. So, I think this is a great improvement, because you get all those good utility-spells that are essential to the game by swapping redundant spells when you get more powerful versions as your gain sorcerer levels.

 

[Khaalis]

In the alt.sorcerer I am working on I took a page from Sean K. Reynolds idea of Spell Paths and slightly alterred Spell Swapping to make the Sorcerer a little more flexible and able to change those "now worthless" spell selections such as Summon Monster I and sleep. For more on Spell Paths you can check out Sean's website at: http://www.seankreynolds.com/rpgfiles/misc/pathmagic.html

"Upon reaching 4th level, and at every even-numbered sorcerer level after that (6th, 8th, and so on), a sorcerer can choose to learn a new spell in place of one he already knows. In effect, the sorcerer “loses” the old spell in exchange for the new one. The new spell’s level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged, and it must be at least two levels lower than the highest-level sorcerer spell the sorcerer can cast. A sorcerer may swap only a single spell at any given level, and must choose whether or not to swap the spell at the same time that he gains new spells known for the level.

Sorcerer spells can also grow in time and evolve into more powerful versions of old spells. This is referred to as Spell Evolution. This concept is based on the concept of spell paths (by Sean K. Reynolds), a series of spells that build and grow upon the same basic premise. When a sorcerer acquires new known spells, and they have a spell that exists on a spell path with an appropriate higher-level spell available, the sorcerer can choose to “upgrade” the spell-path spell they already know, replacing the original spell with the upgraded spell. They may then fill the abandoned spell slot with another spell that is available to them of the same spell level. A sorcerer can only upgrade one spell in this manner at any given level, even if they have multiple options for upgrading.
[Example: Vond is a Sor5 who knows the invisibility spell. Upon reaching Sor6 he acquires a new 3rd-level spell known. Invisibility is a 2nd-level spell on the “Path of Invisibility” and invisibility sphere is a 3rd-level spell on that spell-path. Vond decides to upgrade his invisibility to invisibility sphere, which uses his new 3rd-level spell known slot. However, he now has an open spell known slot at 2nd level (formerly occupied by invisibility), which he may use to learn any other 2nd-level spell available to him.]"

 

[Telperion]

A bit more flavorful. I like it .