Greater True Strike

[Vrecknidj]

Thanee,

That's what I don't like about metamagic feats. I don't think the Greater True Strike spell is even close to as good as an average 5th level spell. Perhaps for a really high level caster it's no big deal to "waste" a 5th level spell, but for much of a wizard's adventuring career, even having a 5th level spell is a rare thing.

Dave

 

[Thanee]

Well, you could make a "similar" spell just like Featherfall, which can be cast as a free action. Or is that a swift action these days?

I just think the free action would be the best way to make True Strike "better".

JimAde - Can't that sorcerer pick up Arcane Preparation? It's well worth to spend two feats on Quicken Spell for a sorcerer, because the benefit is higher than what the wizard gets (more spells per day and even after using some slots the full alotment of spells is still available)!

Bye
Thanee

 

[JimAde]

Well, you could make a "similar" spell just like Featherfall, which can be cast as a free action. Or is that a swift action these days?

I just think the free action would be the best way to make True Strike "better".

JimAde - Can't that sorcerer pick up Arcane Preparation? It's well worth to spend two feats on Quicken Spell for a sorcerer, because the benefit is higher than what the wizard gets (more spells per day and even after using some slots the full alotment of spells is still available)!

Bye
Thanee

Sorry, I'm not familiar with Arcane Preparation. Where is it from? I really like the idea of just making Greater True Strike have a casting time of Free Action. That rocks. Then there's no question of whether you lose it when casting another spell, etc. Very clean. Probably...3rd level? It seems more powerful that way than Vrecknidj's original write-up.

 

[Thanee]

It's in Tome & Blood and I think in Player's Guide to Faerun. I guess it will find its way into Complete Arcane as well.

Basically just allows a spontaneous caster to "prepare" spells like wizards do (but without a book, just from their spells known), specifically meant to circumvent the casting time increase for metamagic with the inherent disadvantage, that the spell and metamagic have to be decided upon beforehand (the wizard's disadvantage).



I'd probably set it at 4th or even 5th level, tho, considering that a quickened True Strike is 5th, it shouldn't be too much lower than that. And a +20 to hit is basically a guarantee (well 95% ) in most cases, that your important touch spell is going to hit, plus ignores concealment. That's not a minor ability for spells like Otto's Irresistible Dance or Disintegrate!

As a comparison, there is a 4th level spell in PGtF - Spell Enhancer - which works like that (free action) and gives the next spell a +2 to caster level.

Bye
Thanee

 

[ruleslawyer]

Sorry, I'm not familiar with Arcane Preparation. Where is it from? I really like the idea of just making Greater True Strike have a casting time of Free Action. That rocks. Then there's no question of whether you lose it when casting another spell, etc. Very clean. Probably...3rd level? It seems more powerful that way than Vrecknidj's original write-up.

I wouldn't allow it, period. Quickened true strike is the single most popular use of Quicken IMC, bar none. Let the PC take the feat and use the base spell.

 

[Vrecknidj]

I wouldn't allow it, period. Quickened true strike is the single most popular use of Quicken IMC, bar none. Let the PC take the feat and use the base spell.

Honestly, no one in the campaign I DM, or in the one I play in, has ever taken Quicken Spell, and, interestingly, no one has ever used True Strike except with melee and ranged weapons (never with a spell). So, though I know that using True Strike in these ways is a great idea for a wizard, I wasn't thinking of them at all when I made up the Greater True Strike idea. [And no, I'm not hereby asking for all kinds of quasi-flame comments about how stupid or worthless my players are; we just don't play many spellcasters, and when we do, they're almost always multi-classed.]

So, suppose I modify the spell so that it does what it does, but only applies to actual weapons (and not to any spells).

Is it now an acceptable 2nd level spell?

Dave

 

[rrealm]

Honestly, no one in the campaign I DM, or in the one I play in, has ever taken Quicken Spell, and, interestingly, no one has ever used True Strike except with melee and ranged weapons (never with a spell). So, though I know that using True Strike in these ways is a great idea for a wizard, I wasn't thinking of them at all when I made up the Greater True Strike idea. [And no, I'm not hereby asking for all kinds of quasi-flame comments about how stupid or worthless my players are; we just don't play many spellcasters, and when we do, they're almost always multi-classed.]

So, suppose I modify the spell so that it does what it does, but only applies to actual weapons (and not to any spells).

Is it now an acceptable 2nd level spell?

Dave

IMC I see true strike cast about once every three sessions and nearly always for a ray spell. Most casters IMC don't multiclass though. I don't think my players would ever take quickened true strike though. too expensive (a feat and a 5th level spell). Plus, at the level which you have 5th level spells, most people don't use up all thier first level spells so they can memorize plenty of true strikes and the other party members can handle one round of the caster "doing nothing" if it means landing a good ray spell.

 

[GlassJaw]

I wouldn't allow it. For one thing, it further devalues Quicken Spell. In 3.5, casting 2 spells per round is VERY powerful. My Drd/Wiz/MT uses Quickened True Strikes all the time and I use a TON of touch spells (ray of enfeeblement, poison, bestow curse, etc). Heck, I even use Quickened Spectral Hand!! If he had a lower level spells that did the same thing, it would get downright disgusting.

It's the kind of thing that doesn't seem like a big of a deal on paper but once you see it in play, you understand.

 

[ruleslawyer]

Honestly, no one in the campaign I DM, or in the one I play in, has ever taken Quicken Spell, and, interestingly, no one has ever used True Strike except with melee and ranged weapons (never with a spell). So, though I know that using True Strike in these ways is a great idea for a wizard, I wasn't thinking of them at all when I made up the Greater True Strike idea. [And no, I'm not hereby asking for all kinds of quasi-flame comments about how stupid or worthless my players are; we just don't play many spellcasters, and when we do, they're almost always multi-classed.]

So, suppose I modify the spell so that it does what it does, but only applies to actual weapons (and not to any spells).

Is it now an acceptable 2nd level spell?

Dave

Actually, Dave, my problem was never with your spell, but with JimAde's suggestion that it be available as a 3rd-level spell with a free action casting time, which I think is too powerful. I think yours is fine, even if it can apply to ray spells and weapons. The fact that you have to waste an action casting it, and that it elapses after 1 round/level, does enough to balance it IMHO.

 

[John Q. Mayhem]

The CBoEM has a 2nd-level spell that's exactly like True Strike but affects the first attack made within 1 round/level. It's a Dragon Magic spell, and requires a feat to pick up it and some others.