have any of you changed the toughness feat?
- Thread starter Sanackranib
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Jeff Wilder
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Toughness has undergone several changes in our games.
(1) Toughness upped the HD by one step, to a maximum of d12 (since nobody is tougher than a barbarian!).
(2) The splatbooks came out, and we used the various Monster's Toughness feats.
(3) That was unsatisfying, so we went back to (1), until someone pointed out to me the obvious ... it made no sense that a barbarian couldn't gain any benefit from Toughness. So I changed it to +1 hit point per level, retroactive. This was practically the same, except for the slightly reduced benefit at 1st level.
(4) Complete Warrior was released, basically codifying the standard "fix" for Toughness, but with a prereq. So we changed it very slightly, such that if one takes Toughness, upon reaching the prereq, it auto-morphs into Improved Toughness. (Yes, this means that some weaker classes get slightly more utility at low levels from Toughness than Good-Fort classes get. THey need it.)
Through all these iterations, it has never become a Must Have feat. From all four of our current games, only one PC has Toughness/Improved Toughness.
(1) Toughness upped the HD by one step, to a maximum of d12 (since nobody is tougher than a barbarian!).
(2) The splatbooks came out, and we used the various Monster's Toughness feats.
(3) That was unsatisfying, so we went back to (1), until someone pointed out to me the obvious ... it made no sense that a barbarian couldn't gain any benefit from Toughness. So I changed it to +1 hit point per level, retroactive. This was practically the same, except for the slightly reduced benefit at 1st level.
(4) Complete Warrior was released, basically codifying the standard "fix" for Toughness, but with a prereq. So we changed it very slightly, such that if one takes Toughness, upon reaching the prereq, it auto-morphs into Improved Toughness. (Yes, this means that some weaker classes get slightly more utility at low levels from Toughness than Good-Fort classes get. THey need it.)
Through all these iterations, it has never become a Must Have feat. From all four of our current games, only one PC has Toughness/Improved Toughness.
In mine it is 1hp/hd (min 3), stackable. Still havent had anyone take it except as a prereq. Although the mage in the party was thinking about being human, taking it twice at first level, and actually being able to take a hit 
(low con, decided to lower int and boost con instead)
Really though, even this version is fairly weak. It is pretty much always roughly one hit or less worth of damage. The dodge feat (which is incredibly, horribly weak) prevents a whole hit every 20 strikes from one foe. Assuming that he gets 20 strikes against him in one day then dodge will very likely save from enough damage/special effects/whatever to be more worthwhile than even this version of toughness.
Going with that, I dont really understand why it hasnt been changed long since
(low con, decided to lower int and boost con instead)Really though, even this version is fairly weak. It is pretty much always roughly one hit or less worth of damage. The dodge feat (which is incredibly, horribly weak) prevents a whole hit every 20 strikes from one foe. Assuming that he gets 20 strikes against him in one day then dodge will very likely save from enough damage/special effects/whatever to be more worthwhile than even this version of toughness.
Going with that, I dont really understand why it hasnt been changed long since
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