D&D 5E Help Me Combine the Wizard and Sorcerer Classes (+)

[el-remmen]

So as part of my Vanity Frankenstein 5E project (i.e. building my own version of the game using any and all previous [and current] editions and variants and homebrew stuff), I am redoing every class and giving each 3 subclass choices.

One thing I am considering is combining the two arcane classes into one class with subclasses determining the difference. I was never a fan of the sorcerer when it first appeared in 3E (I replaced it with a homebrew Witch class back then) and while I allowed it when I started running 5E I still find it superfluous.

So my idea is to replace the Wizard and Sorcerer bases with the Mage class. This class starts with some innate magic - but at 3rd level when subclass choice time arrives, they have to decide how they will continue their study of magic.

If they want to go the scholarly/sagely route they take the wizard subclass. When you choose it, you may take a specialty in a school of magic, but rather than each being its own subclass, each gives you a bonus to learning spells of that school and you cast them a little better (still working out those details). They need spell books, etc to prepare and cast spells above 1st level.

If you want to continue the innate magic path, you become a Sorcerer, basically a wild mage, with manipulating raw magic and choosing various metamagic abilities. Taking the "quick path" makes it more likely to have additional unpredictable effects to your spells when you cast them - some good, some bad, some great, some worse.

The final subclass is the most up in the air conceptually, but I am thinking of some kind of elementalist class that may use runes.

Anyway, with the caveat that this is a "+" thread - anybody have ideas for moving forward with this basic idea? I am totally willing to crib things off any edition or other game.

Oh and in case it is relevant, my version of 5E has been squoshed down to 10 levels and you get feats (or ASIs) at 4th, 8th, and 10th levels - and I have increased the XP needed to go up each level a bit, making it take longer to advance. This means that in general there will be no spells above 5th level (tho I plan to occasionally make the "older magic" available - 6th+ level spells - via scrolls or magic items and am considering that capstone ability will be choose a higher level spell outside the bounds of what the class gets that can be cast as a ritual and/or under limited circumstances).

I will leave it at that for now, despite having a few other ideas, because I am interested in what other people come up with and leaving it open will potentially give me the most raw material to work with even if the details don't fit the specific game vibe I am going for.

 

[Stormonu]

Having a Mage class with Sorcerer/Wizard split via subclass (maybe throw Warlock in there too somehow?) is a great idea. If you do so, I suggest that at 1st level you have the character choose their "source" or style of magic. You can then throw in the various Wizard specialists, Warlock patrons and Sorcerer "Bloodlines/Paths", with each having a requirement of a specific source of magic. Maybe make more sources if you are so inclined.

SOURCES

Spellbook: Your character's spell power comes from memorization. They keep their spells in a spellbook. This allows you to store additional spells that you can swap in an out of being prepared spells.

Innate: Your character's spell power comes from an innate ability to control raw magic. This gives you spell points based on your hit dice, which you can use to cast extra spells or alter magic via metamagics.

Pact: Your character's spell power comes from an agreement with a supernatural being of great power who loans spell power to you. You gain access to invocations that grant you unique or repeatable abilities.

 

[Reynard]

I think a Warlock variant would be a good thematic third choice. Wizards study. Sorcerers embrace their natural talent. But warlocks circumvent the studying by being granted arcane knowledge -- for a price.

 

[el-remmen]

(maybe throw Warlock in there too somehow?)

I think a Warlock variant would be a good thematic third choice. Wizards study. Sorcerers embrace their natural talent. But warlocks circumvent the studying by being granted arcane knowledge -- for a price.

I considered this approach - but right now I am actually making the warlock class as a kind of alternate cleric. Clerics worship one of the 13 Gods accepted as legit by mainstream society, while Warlocks make pacts with the Under Gods (demons, devils, other extraplanar beings, even alternate or syncretic forms of the 13 Gods) and are more "culty" for lack of a better term.

 

[DeviousQuail]

For an elemental (or not) based rune subclass I think starting from the UA Rune Priest and 5e Rune Knight works well. You use your spell slots to make runes that are applied to weapons, armor, jewelry, paper, coins, etc. The Rune Priest runes had simple and complex properties whereas the Rune Knight runes have a passive and active effect. I can see a Rune Mage being able to cast spells or create effects through their runes that are more powerful when they use higher level spells. You might have some spells, especially if you're waiting until 3rd level for the subclass. They just won't be the focus the same way they are for the Wizard and Sorcerer.

 

[CreamCloud0]

sounds interesting though if i might throw in my own two cents, i personally would avoid leaning too heavily on having wild magic be 'the thing' for the sorcerer and stick to the metamagic flexibility, wild magic effects are, well, IMO more a gimmick than something you want your build to rely on, especially with no way to hedge your bets on the effects.

as an alternative to warlock filling out the triad what about the bard? going for more of a mind-body-spirit trio with wizard and sorcerer. wizards specialise in mastering certain types of magic, sorcerers specialise in modifying how the magic they have functions and bards specialise in accessing and mimicing lots of different kinds of magic with magical secrets, i don't know if DnD ever really had a proper spell-mimic but you might take some inspiration and riff off this ability the arcane trickster had but with less stealing vibes and more replication:

Spell Thief​

At 17th level, you gain the ability to magically steal the knowledge of how to cast a spell from another spellcaster.

Immediately after a creature casts a spell that targets you or includes you in its area of effect, you can use your reaction to force the creature to make a saving throw with its spellcasting ability modifier. The DC equals your spell save DC. On a failed save, you negate the spell's effect against you, and you steal the knowledge of the spell if it is at least 1st level and of a level you can cast (it doesn't need to be a wizard spell). For the next 8 hours, you know the spell and can cast it using your spell slots. The creature can't cast that spell until the 8 hours have passed.

Once you use this feature, you can't use it again until you finish a long rest.

if you want an overarching mechanic for the class i feel like spell points are the most obvious, sorcerer naturally uses them for metamagic, wizard uses them to reduce the cost of their favoured spells or as a currency for a version of that quick-memorisation feature they got to swap out their spells on the fly, and bard can use them as currency for either their mimicry or their bardic inspiration if they keep that in your version of the class.

edit,
wizard: "magic is a science to be researched and perfected"
sorcerer: "magic is a muscle to be strengthened and trained"
bard: "magic is an artform to be experienced and expressed"