Help with a rogue build please

[Borthos]

Touche, dandu.

[MENTION=6678119]Jackinthegreen[/MENTION], I'll check out the guisarme, sounds nice.

Speaking of "____ of Justice," I wonder if my DM will allow my homemade magic item, the "Flashlight of Justice."

 

[Borthos]

Are you limited to PHB only, or core only? My two favorite core rogue races are both in the monster manual (Forest Gnome and Deep Halfling), hence why I ask.

The best rogue in core is probably the flask rogue, though you said you don't want to TWF...

I would look into prestige classes and multiclassing, you can't rely on just sneak attack in core, too much crap is immune and you have no feats or items to let you piss on those immunities. Use Magic Device is always helpful, but pricy to fall back on often.

Would you be willing to do Arcane Trickster? They're probably the best "Rogues" in core. Dipping Shadowdancer for two levels isn't a bad idea, otherwise.

If you do have a martial weapon in mind, pick a race that gives proficiency with it for free or else multiclass with Ranger or something as Dandu suggested. Don't waste a feat on it.

EDIT: To do the hide, jump out and attack, jump back idea, go for Spring Attack and dip Shadowdancer for Hide in Plain Sight, and you're pretty much set.

I was thinking about shadowdancer. I like the flavor and I like the shadow jump ability. Very much so. The AT I've looked at but I'm not really fond of.

I'm thinking the following:
human
STR 18 (16)
DEX 16 (10)
CON 15 (8)
INT 14 (6)
WIS 14 (6)
CHA 10 (2)

Levels [feats]:
1 Rogue [Dodge, Combat Reflexes]
2 Fighter [Mobility]
3 Rogue [Combat Expertise]
4 Rogue
5 Fighter [Spring Attack]
6 Rogue [Improved Trip]
7 Ranger (favored enemy, why not?)
8-17 Shadowdancer [Improved Trip at 9, icing on the cake]


what do you think?

 

[Dandu]

Shadowdancer is very flavorful. Also, very sucky.

 

[Borthos]

is it really that bad? I wouldn't think so if only using CRB. which we are.

 

[Dandu]

What does it give that help with CRB?

Also, what is CRB?

 

[Borthos]

Well hide in plain sight is useful, shadow jump is situationally useful but hard to get use of it throughout the day, the shade is a useful flanking buddy, and darkvision is always useful but it comes too late to be worth noting.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Dandu, Shadowdancer is fine for 2 levels. It only sucks after that. On a related note Borthos, I know you said you like the shadow jumping, but it sucks. Don't get it. It's too limited in use and requires you to pick up a shadow companion that's basically a ticking time bomb for xp loss.

For abilities, I would do Str 14 Dex 18 Con 14 Int 16 Wis 14 Cha 12. Int is 16 because skill points aren't retroactive. Dex is 18 because...you're a rogue. If you want to be a burly rogue, I suppose you could make str and dex 16 and still have two points left over. Probably best then to drop cha to 10 and raise Con to 16.

I recommend considering a 2 level dip in Barbarian, Barb dips were always one of my favorite things to do as a core rogue. Fast movement is great, you get uncanny dodge (or improved) early (if you plan to reach rogue 8 you'll get cheated out of a class feature in the end, though), proficiencies, beefy d12 HD, and once/day you can gain significant combat prowess.

If you want to use a 2H weapon and not be small, I still would avoid human. There's not many good feats in core, it may help early on, but after a while it'll have been a waste. Further, as a rule, I always try to pick a rogue race with some sort of enhanced vision. At the least low-light, ideally darkvision. It's hard to be sneaky when you need to carry a torch...
Dwarf, even with the speed hit, is just crazy awesome with all its racial features. Wood Elf will give you +2 Str and Dex for -2 Con and Int, an overall decent trade. I would go with one of these. Orc (not half-orc) is alright just for the massive str alone, and it has darkvision.

Feats you want: Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack, Improved Initiative. That's basically it. Core sucks like that. You can go Combat Relfexes (I suppose you need it for Shadowdancer anyway), Expertise, Improved Trip if you want, but then you should REALLY be using a spiked chain. Or at least a guisarme.

Other feats: Power Attack if your BAB is alright. Blind-Fight is never awful, but it won't help you get sneak attack when someone's concealed, which kinda bites. There's honestly not much else of benefit to you for feats.

For build, start in Rogue 1. Fit in Barb 2 and Fighter 1 or 2 (only if you need it for feats), otherwise straight rogue until your 2 levels in shadowdancer. See if your DM will allow shadowdancer's evasion stack with yours for Improved Evasion.

 

[Dandu]

Well hide in plain sight is useful, shadow jump is situationally useful but hard to get use of it throughout the day, the shade is a useful flanking buddy, and darkvision is always useful but it comes too late to be worth noting.

You might want to get Hide in Plain Sight from the Assassin since Assassin gives you spells, sneak attack, death attack, and qualifies you for Eldritch Knight, Dragon Disciple, and Arcane Trickster.

Dandu, Shadowdancer is fine for 2 levels. It only sucks after that.

Not even two levels; evasion is redundant, while darkvision is easy to come by. Only uncanny dodge is useful.

 

[Borthos]

What about sticking a level of Ranger in there for the favored enemy?

 

[Dandu]

It can be quite useful if you pick a broad category. Something your DM says you'll face often, for instance.