D&D 5E Help With Disruptive Players(?)

[Ahriri]

Not judging your call, I just like bats and wanted to point out they have good vision. The magical darkness as you pointed out means they were blind as you described. I really don't get the Clerics argument but that's kind of the point of the post. Some people just want to rule them all.... at level 3.

Thanks for pointing it out. I love hearing little facts like that, especially about animals! My knowledge about bats is pretty basic besides knowing about echolocation and that they're adorable.

 

[thorgrit]

It sounds like, fundamentally, the type of game they want to play in, and the type of game you want to run, are two different things. Neither is inherently bad, just incompatible. It might be worthwhile to bring this up, and if a compromise can't be reached, that's okay and nobody's fault.

I'm a bit of a character optimizer myself, which is often thrown into the minmax and powergamer types. What I mean when I say that is I'll look through guides when making a character, looking for info on most effective abilities and spells, and take that into consideration when building. Why take a spell that does 3d6 damage when I could have a spell that does 3d8 damage? Because someone calculated the 3d6 one will hit more often due to targeting a different saving throw that's typically lower, and uses a damage type that's resisted less often. That kind of thing.

If you can reach a compromise, ask them for help in encounter building. Sounds like they have system mastery and know their characters better, so they should be better equipped to know what would be an appropriate challenge. Good encounters will play to their strengths and weaknesses from time to time. Look for ways to proactively let their characters feel powerful, and were wise to make the choices they did, if that's what they want. Like in a game I ran, a player took the Sentinel feat at level 1 - so I made sure there were some smart tactical enemies they faced that knew they were going to be on the losing side so would attempt to withdraw and get away - but the guy with Sentinel gets a free hit anyway and stops them. Or when a wizard first gets access to Fireball, a phalanx of heavily armored (but low dexterity save) warriors bunches up to attack, but one word from the mage and they're obliterated. Find weaknesses too, just don't linger there. A character with Heavy Armor Master can laugh off small arrows that do 1d3 damage all day, but that doesn't help them cross a river. They can have +3 flaming greatswords, but can they impress a courtier from another kingdom with their dancing and conversational skills at the ball to convince them to join the war against the necromancers? You can especially play up a weakness one character has if the other has a strength to cover for both of them.

Perhaps you can get them to agree to a PHB-only normal-power game, if you can also commit to trying to engage their powergaming such that they don't feel like they have to trick you into it.

 

[Greenstone.Walker]

I'm still learning how to properly run a campaign...

Welcome to this side of the GM Screen!

I told a player they couldn't "see" as a bat because they had been deafened ... and they spent an hour arguing with me

This is where you have to put your foot down. Give the players a bit of time to argue their case (personally, I give them 60 seconds) but then make the ruling and move on. If they continue the argument then give them the hard choice: either accept the ruling and keep playing or you pack up your stuff and no-one plays any more this session. Be prepared to actually pack up and leave. You should only have to do that once.

This player insists that their character is good even though they do this...

It doesn't matter what the player says; alignment is determined by the character's actions.

This cleric now has a reputation as a rude, shady character. Merchants will charge them higher prices, if they even sell at all. Anyone negotiating is going to ask for money up front. Anyone the cleric asks favours from is going to refuse.

Make sure that in-game actions have in-game consequences.

...their ACs have been around 22-25 since the beginning of the campaign (level 3).

First, as suggested elsewhere on this thread, get someone to check the maths.

Second, there are many ways of attacking characters that don't involve attack rolls; namely saving throws and ability checks. High AC doesn't stop an opponent from grappling or knocking prone, or from casting a charm spell.

Don't overdo it. If the players have chosen high armour then they want their characters to shine in combat. Make sure you are a champion of the characters, giving them chances to feel badass as the blows of their enemies bounce harmlessly off their armour.

The most effective way to deal with high AC is, however, the escort quest *evil laugh*. It doesn't matter if Brom the Barbarian has 22 AC if the princess he is escorting has 10.

...but I feel miserable.

As a GM, you absolutely have the same right to fun as everyone else at the table. You are not there to sacrifice your fun for theirs. If it is not fun then stop and have the difficult conversation with them, "Look, friends, this is not fun for me."

Finally, remember that stopping playing D&D with your friends does not mean they have to stop being your friends!

 

[Wepwawet]

(...) But I've been forced to appease her because there are only two players (the others left because they got too busy to keep joining). When she throws a fit, she refuses to communicate for the rest of the session and it makes things horribly awkward for me and the other player.

Are you sure that the others got too busy to keep joining? Sounds like that player makes everyone's experience so horrible that people drop out and make up an excuse to sound nice.

Yeah, like many people said, just end that game, as quickly as possible.

Have that merchant god show up, point out how evil they actually are, and pulls the souls out of their characters.

Bad gaming is much worse than no gaming at all.

 

[billd91]

Are you sure that the others got too busy to keep joining? Sounds like that player makes everyone's experience so horrible that people drop out and make up an excuse to sound nice.

They very well could be using "being busy" as an excuse to not keep playing without having to confront the cleric player with her behavior. Definitely consider contacting them privately. Ask them if they really are busy or if they're trying to spare someone's feelings. They might be more candid if you broach the topic with them, assuming they aren't being completely candid now.