Help with Skill, LA, etc.

[Macgyvercas]

Okay, so I had an idea for an adventure, but I need some help making the end boss. It's a natural lycanthrope that has become a lich (yes, I know that's probably not possible unless a deity is involved, but that's not the issue here).

Okay, so the base creature is a lvl 11 Sorcerer, natural lycanthrope (werewolf). So if I'm not mistaken, that would mean his Level Adjustment is +3 and I think his level increases for each animal HD he has (in this case two).

First question: If my calculations are correct, that would make him an ECL 16, would it not? Does that mean he would have the skills, feats and ability score increases of a level 16 character?

Second Question: When applying skills you get from the animal HD (2+Int per animal HD), does the character get the skills of the animal and then add the skill points, or do you just get the skill points (in this case, 6 skill points)?

Next, the character becomes a Lich (again, please disregard logistics), which means an additional +4 LA. So if I'm correct, that means that he would now be a ECL 20. Again, does he get the skills, feats and ability score increases of a level 20 character or no? Also, when a Lich's hit dice increase to d12s does that include the animal HD?

Any help on this would be great.

 

[Duke Arioch]

LA levels do not provide skills, HPs or feats. Racial (animal etc.) HD do.

 

[Gray Lensman]

But then again, if your the DM, it's up to YOU.

What works with your players?

What works with you?

Back before there was such as LA and ECL I did many things with ENEMY NPCs that were not quite right within the RULES.

Got to keep your players guessing, yes?

 

[Duke Arioch]

Actually, you could homebrew that LA level equals racial HD... But, IMHO, there was a reason those two are different. LA is a nice offset to powers granted by the race.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

As a DM, LA does not matter to you.

LA matters how powerful certain abilities are in the PCs hands.

You want CR adjustments, which are how much more powerful certain things make your monsters.

 

[Macgyvercas]

As a DM, LA does not matter to you.

LA matters how powerful certain abilities are in the PCs hands.

You want CR adjustments, which are how much more powerful certain things make your monsters.

So, since the character gets two levels from the HD, he would be a level 13 character. I assume that means feats skills and abilities of a lvl 13?

How do CR adjustments work?

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Basically, when you create a lycanthope, it's like you multiclassed into an animal.

So, your (human?) Sorc 11 would have two "levels" in Wolf. He'd have a creature type of Humanoid (Human, Shapechanger). He'd have hit points equal to 11d4 (Sorcerer) + 2d8 (Wolf) + Constitution modifier * 13. He'd gain the normal skill points for being a Sor11, and would get 2+Int Mod * 2 skill points for his wolf half, for which Hide, Move Silently, Listen, Spot, and Survival would count as class skills. He'd receive the feats Track and Weapon Focus (Bite) for free.

The rules on lycanthropy state that a 2HD base animal - like a wolf - is worth a +2 CR adjustment. Character-classed enemies have a CR equal to their level. So, a level 11 sorcerer is a CR 11 creature, or roughly a good combat challenge for an 11th-level party. Since he's a "2 HD" lycanthrope, his CR is adjusted up by 2, to CR 13.

You can find all the rules on lycanthropy here: Lycanthrope :: d20srd.org

Let me know if you have any other questions!

 

[Macgyvercas]

Basically, when you create a lycanthope, it's like you multiclassed into an animal.

So, your (human?) Sorc 11 would have two "levels" in Wolf. He'd have a creature type of Humanoid (Human, Shapechanger). He'd have hit points equal to 11d4 (Sorcerer) + 2d8 (Wolf) + Constitution modifier * 13. He'd gain the normal skill points for being a Sor11, and would get 2+Int Mod * 2 skill points for his wolf half, for which Hide, Move Silently, Listen, Spot, and Survival would count as class skills. He'd receive the feats Track and Weapon Focus (Bite) for free.

The rules on lycanthropy state that a 2HD base animal - like a wolf - is worth a +2 CR adjustment. Character-classed enemies have a CR equal to their level. So, a level 11 sorcerer is a CR 11 creature, or roughly a good combat challenge for an 11th-level party. Since he's a "2 HD" lycanthrope, his CR is adjusted up by 2, to CR 13.

You can find all the rules on lycanthropy here: Lycanthrope :: d20srd.org

Let me know if you have any other questions!

Makes sense. Now, for skills, does he get the two bonus skill points for being human? (Lycanthrope adds two levels).

And when this guy goes lich, do his animal HD turn into d12s as well?

 

[Thrallherd]

The official Lich template says "All current and future Hit Dice change to d12." Being a werewolf provides 2 Racial Hit Dice. So yes, I believe your animal HD would turn into d12.
Now, let's sit and consider what a Werewolf Lich would look like. A Human/Wolf skeleton-type thing?

 

[Macgyvercas]

The official Lich template says "All current and future Hit Dice change to d12." Being a werewolf provides 2 Racial Hit Dice. So yes, I believe your animal HD would turn into d12.
Now, let's sit and consider what a Werewolf Lich would look like. A Human/Wolf skeleton-type thing?

More or less, depending on what form he's in. Transformation should be fun to describe though. My goal: To be so graphic in the description that someone throws up or passes out.