Hey I had a few questions about the helpless condition. On compendium it only states that a helpless creature grants combat advantage. (It doesn't even mention coup de graces.) Can a helpless creature take actions as normal and isn't really offensively effected by helplessness? I thought it would kinda ya know, make them HELPLESS maybe? But under unconscious it says the creature can't make actions along with being helpless, suggesting that helpless doesn't already include that. Thanks guys.
Helpless
- Thread starter Jkjk
- Start date
Aulirophile
First Post
COUP DE GRACE: STANDARD ACTION
Helpless Target: You can deliver a coup de grace against a helpless enemy adjacent to you. Use any
attack power you could normally use against the enemy, including a basic attack.
Hit: You score a critical hit.
Grants CA and makes you eligible to be CDG'd is it.
Helpless Target: You can deliver a coup de grace against a helpless enemy adjacent to you. Use any
attack power you could normally use against the enemy, including a basic attack.
Hit: You score a critical hit.
Grants CA and makes you eligible to be CDG'd is it.
Nullzone
Explorer
As [MENTION=86312]Aulirophile[/MENTION] said, Helpless as a status just means you grant CA and can be attacked for a CDG (which has the potential for instant death if you deal more than someone's bloodied value in damage). It's usually the result of the Unconscious status, which itself states you get no actions.
So if by some chance there was a status that made you helpless but you weren't unconscious or otherwise actionless, then yes, you would still get your normal actions. But thematically this will probably never happen, as if you have actions you aren't really helpless
So if by some chance there was a status that made you helpless but you weren't unconscious or otherwise actionless, then yes, you would still get your normal actions. But thematically this will probably never happen, as if you have actions you aren't really helpless
sigfile
Explorer
The Wizard's ninth level spell Face of Death does exactly that - it leaves the target active but helpless. It's... weird.So if by some chance there was a status that made you helpless but you weren't unconscious or otherwise actionless, then yes, you would still get your normal actions. But thematically this will probably never happen, as if you have actions you aren't really helpless
Aulirophile
First Post
Actually can happen. Wizards have a Helpless+Stun (Save Ends) Daily... but many Solos are immune to Stun, so they'd only be Helpless.
Truthseeker PP has a similar power.
Face of Death, Wizard 9, inflicts just Helpless on the First Failed Saving Throw.
So three possibilities (oh, and some poorly written monsters).
Truthseeker PP has a similar power.
Face of Death, Wizard 9, inflicts just Helpless on the First Failed Saving Throw.
So three possibilities (oh, and some poorly written monsters).
Nullzone
Explorer
Just looked up those powers...yeah, that's really weird. Face of Death I kind of understand but the thematical and mechanical bits aren't seeing eye to eye; if you're helpless, I'd expect you were either stunned or on the ground. Doesn't make sense that someone would be frozen in terror such that they can be brutally attacked like a CDG, and then turn around on their turn and snap right back into battle...
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DracoSuave
First Post
It IS kinda wierd, but the primary thing to understand is that outside of a very very small handful of powers, the vast majority of creatures that are helpless are because they are unconscious.
Being helpless just means you can be coup-de-grace'd. That's all it does, nothing more. It's usually added on to something else tho, so you're, as pointed out above... you're stunned OH AND BY THE WAY COUP DE GRACE TIME, to point out the extra vulnerability inherent in that state of being.
It's just a game term, move along.
Being helpless just means you can be coup-de-grace'd. That's all it does, nothing more. It's usually added on to something else tho, so you're, as pointed out above... you're stunned OH AND BY THE WAY COUP DE GRACE TIME, to point out the extra vulnerability inherent in that state of being.
It's just a game term, move along.
Saeviomagy
Adventurer
It's magic. It can do wierd things. Probably the issue with it is simply the word "helpless". If "helpless" instead said something like "deathly" or "executable" or somesuch, it wouldn't be an issue.
Nemesis Destiny
Adventurer
Coup de grace has come up so rarely in my games that I find it isn't even an issue.
