D&D 5E "Surrender or Die" Roared the Barbarian - Making the Opponents Surrender

@mearls is introducing morale in his game, probably.
I looked over Mearl's morale concept. It requires a lot of tracking and rolls, and has a 25% that after a single lowly monster is dropped to 50% health that the entire monster group will flee.

I wasn't a big fan, the old 2e morale I think is so much cleaner and simpler.
 

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and as we all know, PCs try to be the one-time special case every single session:)


I will say, I do like the old school morale rules, they are very simple and yet effective. However, my take on this one is that the OP isn't just looking for a "when do the monsters run" system, they want something where the players can generate that through like an intimidate action....and that's the real discussion.

But yeah if your looking for pure morale, I think the old 2e system pretty much nailed it.
Player generation of this stuff is essentially ignoring the hit point system, to be fair. Why not just give monsters fewer hp if this a concern at your table?
 

Taking consideration of morale and tactical considerations is good, but there's no one-size-fits-all game mechanical solution that will work equally well for every opponent and situation. I'm definitely in the camp of this being a decision for the DM to make on a case-by-case basis.
 

Ya, I agree. Rules are not needed. DM fiat.
I am of the opposite opinion, of course. Leaving morale up to DM fiat doesn't work for me, speaking as an eternal DM. I'd rather have a system the players can initiate if they choose and a standardized system. I can modify the chances on the fly based on the situation, but I need a sturdy base to work from.

I never liked the old morale rules of BX and 1E/2E as it was too binary with often results that just felt off. I'd rather a "degrading morale" over a flip of switch. Maybe something more along levels of Exhaustion that dealing psychic damage as I think about it.
 

Wow, all intelligent creatures are fanatics in your game that fight to the death? Heck, we even have beasts that try to run if not doing things like protecting young.
 

I usually have a set of conditions where the opponents will flee or even surrender. As others have said, most sentient creatures want to live.

There could be also other reasons why opponents flee rather than stay to die:
  • bringing back information on the party to their bosses,
  • delaying tactics,
  • they have achieved some other goal and are getting out of dodge.
 

Doesn't this just reduce the odds of a Flee result, sort of like giving a bonus to the save vs. panic on a d20? I mean, someone could insist that the bonus should have a bell-curve adjustment.
It does. The problem with the RAW morale check is that IME the swinginess of the d20 makes it much more likely for enemies to flee than they should. With a bell-curve, and automatically rolling when first damaged and bloodied, you have a generally better average result.
 

I usually have a set of conditions where the opponents will flee or even surrender. As others have said, most sentient creatures want to live.

There could be also other reasons why opponents flee rather than stay to die:
  • bringing back information on the party to their bosses,
  • delaying tactics,
  • they have achieved some other goal and are getting out of dodge.
That's fine for the DM to have those sort of things in mind, and act on them as part of their strategy.

This is primarily for the players to push an opponent back out of the fight (flee, surrender or otherwise submit) on the player's terms, not at the will or whim of the DM.
 

I will always let my players roll to intimidate if they wish, but the DC starts high and can only be lowered when the enemy starts taking losses.

Most recently happened when the party Warlock not only dropped but outright killed a Duergar Mind Master with a single Blight spell and it scared all the other Duergar straight.
 

That's fine for the DM to have those sort of things in mind, and act on them as part of their strategy.

This is primarily for the players to push an opponent back out of the fight (flee, surrender or otherwise submit) on the player's terms, not at the will or whim of the DM.
I don't understand. You want the players to control whether or not the monsters run away (not the situation, or the monsters themselves through the DM)?
 

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