D&D General Higher Level = Greater Complexity = Slower Play

[mellored]

Higher level = more experienced players = faster play.

Fastet enough to counter the increased complexity or not will vary wildly by table.

But you can always roll new characters once you hit level 10.

 

[Oofta]

It depends on the players. High level players can be quite efficient the high level PCs I play aren't much slower, although obviously there can be more numbers to track. You just have to pay attention and keep engaged, find efficient ways to resolve your turn like rolling attacks and damage at the same time or even rolling ahead of time.

But others? Once you get to even mid-low levels they have to sit and analyze every possible option just in case there's a more optimal move. If someone is dedicated to rolling one die at a time for absolutely everything then when you have more dice to roll it will take more time.

But I'm not sure you really have that many more options at high levels. Even a 20th level caster doesn't have all that many spells applicable for combat than, say, a 5th level caster.

There are many ways to make high level combat faster. Have color coded dice and roll multiple attacks and damage at the same time. Use average damage (I even allow rounding up) instead of rolling. Accept that you don't have minutes to decide what to do because your PC doesn't either. If someone seems stuck as a DM I'll often list possible options that I see, although of course they can always do something else. As a DM, don't get carried away with overly complex scenarios*.

Some people will just be more efficient at running their PCs at all levels, some DMs will be more efficient at keeping a game moving. Higher level is always going to be at least a little bit slower, in 5E it doesn't have to be significantly slower.

*which can happen at all levels, I just had a combat scenario recently for a level 2 group that took what seemed like it took forever.

 

[billd91]

Let's be honest. Only part of game that slows down at high level is combat.

That’s not necessarily true. More powerful characters, whether measured in levels or build points, tend to have more options available to them outside of combat as well as in combat. And that can lead to longer discussions of what to do, how to approach a situation, then when they have fewer options.

 

[GrimCo]

In d&d? Not really. There are very few mechanics beside skills that deal with out of combat challenges. And skills just get bigger numbers. Social pillar is mostly handled trough pure RP.

 

[prabe]

That’s not necessarily true. More powerful characters, whether measured in levels or build points, tend to have more options available to them outside of combat as well as in combat. And that can lead to longer discussions of what to do, how to approach a situation, then when they have fewer options.

I've seen players in my D&D 5e campaigns take large chunks of in-game time to figure out both what to do next in the sense of goals, and how to handle a given situation. None of those long discussions have seemed to me--as an interested observer--to be more complex at higher levels, especially when goal-selection was happening. Of course, the goals will probably be different--and plausibly more complex--for more powerful characters.

 

[Stormonu]

For me, it's not so much that high level combat is a slog because of options.

It's whether or not the characters even choose to engage in what you've prepared. Teleport, scry, plane shift and more give the players options to do things and go places its sometimes hard to foresee. Players pore over and scan their character sheets and "aha!" they find something that just grinds the whole table to a halt to find out "how it really works", possibly derailing the entire session resolving some side action.

 

[CreamCloud0]

didn't 4e deal with this issue of exponential options pretty well by having you swapping out between powers in a finite number of slots? you might gain more total powers but there's only so many you're going to be deciding between at any given time in combat.

 

[Oofta]

didn't 4e deal with this issue of exponential options pretty well by having you swapping out between powers in a finite number of slots? you might gain more total powers but there's only so many you're going to be deciding between at any given time in combat.

It's kind of comparing apples to oranges. That, and high level 4E dragged far worse than 5E in my experience, just for other reasons.

 

[CreamCloud0]

It's kind of comparing apples to oranges. That, and high level 4E dragged far worse than 5E in my experience, just for other reasons.

They might be different but comparisons can still be made to a degree can’t they? If the factors that made 4e drag aren’t present in 5e then wouldn’t that structure be one that could help curtail the option choice paralysis issue of 5e?

 

[Oofta]

They might be different but comparisons can still be made to a degree can’t they? If the factors that made 4e drag aren’t present in 5e then wouldn’t that structure be one that could help curtail the option choice paralysis issue of 5e?

Well, for example, one of the strengths of a wizard is that they have a lot of options. Taking those away wouldn't be something many people would want. Also, my high level PCs still had a ton of options, don't let the limited number of powers fool you.

Again though, high level 4E encounters could take hours, heck we timed it once and single turn took an hour. It really was a very different beast.