D&D 5E Homebrew question of if Player should be allowed

[GMforPowergamers]

I have a newish player. He came in 3/4 of the way through our last campaign and played a normal character. We started a new campaign and he asked to modified ranger slightly to be more of an urban ranger, and I read like 5 pages of his flavor text changes for like 3 mechanical changes, and I said OK.

Now we are preping for a new campaign (he has been gaming with us a year and has been a perfect player no complaints, no spotlight hogging, and no major power gaming) and he has asked again to modified a class... but this is MORE.

he wants to be a sorcerer. However instead of taking from the sorcerer spell list he wants 1 bard cantrip, and the rest (including all when leveled) to come from the Druid list. He wants to forgo the normal subclass and in it's place get a specialized animal companion that will be limited to a CR that if he were a druid he could wild shape into, but follow the rules from pact of the chain warlock. and at level 6 he would get the misty escape of a 6th level fey lock, and at 14th level he would get the 10th level beguiling defense of the fey lock.

SO he would have meta magic, sorcerer spells known (but from druid spell list)except he wants Vicious Mockery as a pick.

He has a backstory that is rife with stuff for me to play with... but that is a lot to unpack for a 'can I make some changes' that feels more like "can I make my own class"

The rest of my players have been with me 10 years, 18 years, and just over 20 years. Over those years and all the editions we have all asked for 'can I just twist this rule' but not all the time... and this is out of 3 characters the 2nd time he has. This guy seems to be cool but I need some input before I ask the guys.


His background: his mother was a fey spirit like a nymph. His father was an elven bladesinger... his father is part of a noble line, he has his father (and his grandmother before that)'s moon blade. His father's wife is also an elven senator and wizard... his half siblings include 2 who are following in his footsteps (twins who are want to be bladesingers, and a son who is apprentice to the mother). His half siblings treat him okay but distrust him, and the mother of his half siblings hate him as a reminder her husband cheated on her.

He mechanicly is taking the 'custom linage' from elf but wants this custom class to go with it

 

[Maxperson]

This seems very highly like a personal table thing. I know that with my group, little requests are often honored unless they are obviously broken. Something major like a completely new class or subclass that a player came up with takes more thought at my table.

If it's obviously broken, I will say what I have issues with and see if the player can fix the problem areas and still keep the class/subclass something he wants to play. If no, it gets dropped at that point. If yes and nothing is obviously broken, I will say yes, but caution the player that if this character turns out to be broken and things need to change mid campaign, we're going to have to change things. If the player wants to proceed with that understanding, then it's all good. If not, then he picks something else.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

it seems not too bad.

1st level: Fae Magic
You learn the Vicious Mockery cantrip. The spells does not count against your know cantrips maximum and is considered a sorcerer spell for you. When your Spellcasting feature lets you learn or replace a sorcerer cantrip or a sorcerer spell of 1st level or higher, you can choose the new spell from the druid spell list or the sorcerer spell list. You must otherwise obey all the restrictions for selecting the spell, and it becomes a sorcerer spell for you.

Faerie Beastmaster
You magically summon a primal beast, which draws strength from your bond with nature. The beast is friendly to you and your companions and obeys your commands. Choose its stat block—Beast of the Land, Beast of the Sea, or Beast of the Sky—which uses your proficiency bonus (PB) in several places. You also determine the kind of animal the beast is, choosing a kind appropriate for the stat block. Whatever kind you choose, the beast bears primal markings, indicating its mystical origin.

In combat, the beast acts during your turn. It can move and use its reaction on its own, but the only action it takes is the Dodge action, unless you take a bonus action on your turn to command it to take another action. That action can be one in its stat block or some other action. You can also sacrifice one of your attacks when you take the Attack action to command the beast to take the Attack action. If you are incapacitated, the beast can take any action of its choice, not just Dodge.

If the beast has died within the last hour, you can use your action to touch it and expend a spell slot of 1st level or higher. The beast returns to life after 1 minute with all its hit points restored.

When you finish a long rest, you can summon a different primal beast. The new beast appears in an unoccupied space within 5 feet of you, and you choose its stat block and appearance. If you already have a beast from this feature, it vanishes when the new beast appears. The beast also vanishes if you die.


6th level: Hidden Paths
Starting at 10th level, you can use the hidden, magical pathways that some fey use to traverse space in the blink of an eye. As a bonus action on your turn, you can teleport up to 60 feet to an unoccupied space you can see. Alternatively, you can use your action to teleport one willing creature you touch up to 30 feet to an unoccupied space you can see.

You can use this feature a number of times equal to your Proficiency Bonus, and you regain all expended uses of it when you finish a long rest or you spend 3 Sorcery points to regain a single use.

14th level: Beguiling Defenses
Beginning at 10th level, your patron teaches you how to turn the mind-affecting magic of your enemies against them. You are immune to being charmed, and when another creature attempts to charm you, you can use your reaction to attempt to turn the charm back on that creature. The creature must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw against your sorcerer spell save DC or be charmed by you for 1 minute or until the creature takes any damage.

18th level: Share Spells
Beginning at 15th level, when you cast a spell targeting yourself, you can also affect your primal companion with the spell if the beast is within 30 feet of you.

 

[BookTenTiger]

I think @vincegetorix has the right of it, this should be written up as a custom subclass.

This player seems really invested! I'd say go for it. Since their idea is based on a character concept, and not just power gaming, I think it would be highly rewarding to work together to make the subclass.

 

[Charlaquin]

No, I wouldn’t allow that. I’d be willing to allow a custom druid subclass that uses wild shape to summon an animal instead of changing into one, and I’d be willing to make the subclass features similar to the fetlock ones, but no Metamagic or other Sorcerer features on top of that, and if they want to learn Vicious Mockery, there are Feats that can accomplish that.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

No, I wouldn’t allow that. I’d be willing to allow a custom druid subclass that uses wild shape to summon an animal instead of changing into one, and I’d be willing to make the subclass features similar to the fetlock ones, but no Metamagic or other Sorcerer features on top of that, and if they want to learn Vicious Mockery, there are Feats that can accomplish that.

If I may ask, what makes you think a druid subclass is better then a sorcerer subclass?

Both are full caster (so powerful) but sorcerer has limited spells known.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

I think @vincegetorix has the right of it, this should be written up as a custom subclass.

This player seems really invested! I'd say go for it. Since their idea is based on a character concept, and not just power gaming, I think it would be highly rewarding to work together to make the subclass.

I love making special class progression tailored to my players' vision of their PC. It reminds me of the old 1e idea of race-as-class, but instead its full-character-as-class, so can put background or race features into the class progression instead of class features that would be less interesting.

 

[ECMO3]

SO he would have meta magic, sorcerer spells known (but from druid spell list)except he wants Vicious Mockery as a pick.

My answer is no. I would encourage him to use RAW to get all those things he wants by implementing optional rules like feats and multiclassing.

Going just with what you state above - Starting with a Variant Human Druid and taking the metamagic feat and then dip Bard at level 2 and he has what you have above by 2nd level (and before a single class sorcerer would actually get metamagic I might add).

If there are specific things he wants that are not hard class abilities then design a custom feat for them.

 

[Regpuppy]

Take Divine Soul sorcerer, replace cleric spell list with the Druid spell list. Nuke the other features and replace with the revised beastmaster companion (primal companion) and give him the associated abilities for that. Adjust levels as needed.

I wouldn't let him stack on anything else until this build was playtested a bit, and regardless of what you end up doing. You should let him know that it may need to get nerfed or altered if it becomes a problem.

Vicious Mockery is easy enough to snag from feats if he wants. But I wouldn't tack on anything more to complicate this build withoit testing.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Just to let everyone know I let him do the things he wants mostly. I listened to advice and was going to tell him reflavoring the new beastmaster pet, and I am not letting him take Vicious Mockery... he will need to take one of the feats for that.

He is okay with it... and then he said he wanted his beastmaster pet to be a chinchilla, and I changed my mind and let it be a familiar instead.

He also put his highest stat in Con, and (after race modifier) his 2 next best tie as Dex and Cha. Now we are useing a modified array for this game (15, 14, 13, 12,12,10) and after +2 +1 he ended up with
10 Str 14 Dex 17 Con 12 Int 12 Wis 14 Cha

at 3rd level he knows 4 spells and 4 cantrips and he has
Guidance, Infestation, Resistance, Shape water
Charm Person, GoodBerry, Speak with animals
Hold Person

I know he has twin spell but I don't remember other metamagic

I will let you know how it goes when we get into game 1.


edit: I went to roll20 the other is Subtle Spell