Hordes of the Abyss.

[Zarnam]

Name, title, concerns, layer. They also have notes. d for deceased, f for female, 0 for obyrith. A - indicates that they don't actually have a laryer of the abyss.

Hmmmm.... that's really better than I expected

 

[JoeGKushner]

I just read the whole review.

Er... so there is no description of the Abyss or its layers whatsoever in the book?

That part of the review hasn't been written yet.

Just figured I'd get what I had up to give people something to digest.

 

[JoeGKushner]

Only in a Forgotten Realms product, and therefore only in the FR cosmology. Core books are not beholden to FR-specific books.

That actually confuses me more.

So now we'll have a Forgotten Realms Lolth and a 'D&D' spider goddess?

It's the whole Tiamat vs Dragonlance all over again!

 

[Sammael]

Ah. So it's either in chapter 5 or one of the appendices.

BTW, now that we're getting a full-fledged review, can we expect Erik and James to comment again? It's not as if book contents are secret anymore.

 

[Sammael]

So now we'll have a Forgotten Realms Lolth and a 'D&D' spider goddess?

Sort of (see below). Blame SKR.

It's the whole Tiamat vs Dragonlance all over again!

Actually, in all fairness, that's what they tried to avoid with the new cosmology. The philosophy is this: as far as FR is concerned, there is only one entity named Lolth, she lives on the plane called the Demonweb Pits, and she is only concerned with Toril. Any other variant of this deity doesn't exist in the FR cosmology. FR Abyss is not the same as the Great Wheel Abyss. Great Wheel Abyss does not exist in FR cosmology.

 

[JoeGKushner]

Chapter 1: Demonic Lore
The black scrolls
The origins of demons
Physiology
Basic functions
Dissection of a Dretch
Demonic Life Cycles

Demons on the Material Plane
Getter There (or Here)

Demons ROles
The Assassin
The Brute
The Corruptor
The Manipulator
The Overlord
Demonic Possession
Possed Creatures
Possed Objects

 

[JoeGKushner]

Sort of (see below). Blame SKR.


Actually, in all fairness, that's what they tried to avoid with the new cosmology. The philosophy is this: as far as FR is concerned, there is only one entity named Lolth, she lives on the plane called the Demonweb Pits, and she is only concerned with Toril. Any other variant of this deity doesn't exist in the FR cosmology. FR Abyss is not the same as the Great Wheel Abyss. Great Wheel Abyss does not exist in FR cosmology.

Isn't that kinda the same with Dragonlance though? It's not like Tiamak and Takhisis both exist on the DL setting.

And Lolth's plane here is still called the Demonweb so I don't exactly see where the confusion is being avoided.

 

[Erik Mona]

Chapter 5, which I assume Joe hasn't digested yet (since he hardly mentioned it in his review) covers the Abyss in pretty great detail. In fact, that chapter (and the lists in the appendices) represents my contribution to the book. I'd guess it's something like 50 pages.

--Erik

 

[Mouseferatu]

Isn't that kinda the same with Dragonlance though? It's not like Tiamak and Takhisis both exist on the DL setting.

And Lolth's plane here is still called the Demonweb so I don't exactly see where the confusion is being avoided.

It's quite easy to avoid confusion, IMO.

Anything it says about Lolth in a brown or blue book is core. Anything it says about Lolth in an off-white book is FR.

As long as folks don't assume a correlation or an interconnection, there's no problem.

 

[ColonelHardisson]

My big concern is that a great wyrm red dragon shouldnt be in the same class powerwise as Demogorgon and Orcus

Yeah, I know. It should be more powerful.