D&D 5E House rule for in combat healing and yoyo at 0 HP

[Clint_L]

It seems to me that most of this problem comes from one spell: healing word. It's just way too powerful and widely available at level 1. A lot of the time there is barely a cost to using it since it runs off the bonus action and you don't even have to put yourself in harm's way.

I have much less problem with yo-yo healing from cure wounds or lay on hands, for example. The character has to get to their downed teammate, putting themselves at risk, and they have to use up their action, which is a much, much bigger deal than using your bonus action.

 

[ad_hoc]

It seems to me that most of this problem comes from one spell: healing word. It's just way too powerful and widely available at level 1. A lot of the time there is barely a cost to using it since it runs off the bonus action and you don't even have to put yourself in harm's way.

I have much less problem with yo-yo healing from cure wounds or lay on hands, for example. The character has to get to their downed teammate, putting themselves at risk, and they have to use up their action, which is a much, much bigger deal than using your bonus action.

There is the rule about not casting a levelled spell when also casting a bonus action spell.

This is less impactful to clerics though I think.

 

[Distracted DM]

Exhausting wounds: If reduced to zero hitpoints a character must succeed on a Constitution save or gain a level of exhaustion. DC is half the damage dealt by the attack, minimum DC 10.

This thread does make me question assumptions; exhaustion for going to 0 is a definite reason to prioritize careful play, to make players really avoid going down (falling back, etc), and to stop players that rely on the Healing Word yo-yo.

BUT what is the problem that's being solved? I guess the problem IS the ridiculousness of the yo-yo.

 

[Staffan]

This thread does make me question assumptions; exhaustion for going to 0 is a definite reason to prioritize careful play, to make players really avoid going down (falling back, etc), and to stop players that rely on the Healing Word yo-yo.

BUT what is the problem that's being solved? I guess the problem IS the ridiculousness of the yo-yo.

The core of the problem is that 5e healing, with the exception of Life clerics and maybe something else with a strong healing focus, is weak – although its weakness is somewhat hidden by the low default difficulty of combat.

Most combats will be over in a small number of rounds, and PCs will likely not be close to dropping, and in those cases healing isn't needed, and would be counter-productive (better to go on the offensive to shorten the fight). But when you do have a difficult fight, and someone is getting pounded, most healing isn't chonky enough to outpace the damage – at least not until you get to things like heal and mass cure wounds. An action spent on cure wounds has a fair chance of being "wasted", because the KO blow would have been enough either way. Essentially, healing is a "lose less" strategy – you're still losing, it just takes longer.

 

[fluffybunbunkittens]

Chase Rules - DMG p 252

Do nothing for this problem... Have you read them?

You still use the exact same movement speeds, keep the exact same turn structure, and start measuring distance from pursuers from exactly where you are (which might be 5 feet from them, with your ally on the ground). The only things changed are that there (likely) aren't attacks of opportunity for running away from being next to someone, and there is the addition of Extra Dashes... which help the faster party more... and whose limiting factor is taking exhaustion, which is a much bigger hindrance to the PCs than one-off enemies.

Plus, any fallen party member would get left behind, or some players would drop during the chase, because the chase rules say you still have access to attacks and spells, because it's just the exact same thing as running a combat (with some extra Dashes thrown in).

 

[fluffybunbunkittens]

It seems to me that most of this problem comes from one spell: healing word.

I hate the spell, yes. But it's just WotC's band-aid to the problem (that one person going down snowballs with smaller parties). It's really unhealthy when everyone should have a bonus action heal, which then loops back to 'intelligent monsters should double-tap'.

And speaking of double-tapping, against anything that does just two attacks, no matter the damage amount or that they're an elite super swordsman, another bonus action spell, Healing Spirit, can make whoever they are attacking literally unkillable (one hit takes them down, the other hit gives them 2 death save failures, at the start of their turn they are healed and death saves are wiped clean). While if that same character, in the same Healing Spirit, faces 3 rats - one rat takes him down, one gives 2 failures, the next gives 2 failures, just dead - which seems just silly.

 

[Mecheon]

There’s other ways to stop yo-yo.

a. Don’t drop characters at all - make 0 hp function differently.
b. Target downed PCs. (Well that kind of be construed as ‘ not letting characters get back up’)

I gotta agree with the stuff upthread that the best way is probably buffing healing. Monster damage outscales healing in pretty much all cases, so the game incentiveses you to focus on dealing damage yourself and taking down the opponent. You're never going to out-heal an opponent's damage, so the only way to ensure everyone's in a safe condition is to put everything into killing an opponent. I'd argue that's also part of why "Potions as a quick action" is such a common house rule, because otherwise you're never going to use a potion that can be wiped out in a single dice roll

Healing needs an incentive to use outside of "Well, the DM's being a jerk" in the case of double tapping

 

[fluffybunbunkittens]

I gotta agree with the stuff upthread that the best way is probably buffing healing.

Maybe everyone should have access to some kind of a... Second Wind...?

Because we also don't want to make parties feel like they have to have a healbot along.

 

[W'rkncacnter]

one rule i've considered using (in addition to falling to 0 gives a level of exhaustion) is any effect which rolls dice for the specific purpose of healing instead simply does maximum healing. so, for example, cure wounds would heal from 8+spellcasting modifier to 72+spellcasting modifier depending on what level you cast it at, as opposed to 1d8 (average 4.5)+spellcasting modifier to 9d8 (averaging 40.5)+spellcasting modifier.

it's kind of similar to the OP's temp hp solution except it doesn't effect already flat healing (which are pretty much universally already the only worthwhile sources of healing anyway). you could also make it so that you still roll, and if you're conscious you gain what you rolled subtracted from the maximum as temp HP.

 

[FrogReaver]

I gotta agree with the stuff upthread that the best way is probably buffing healing. Monster damage outscales healing in pretty much all cases, so the game incentiveses you to focus on dealing damage yourself and taking down the opponent. You're never going to out-heal an opponent's damage, so the only way to ensure everyone's in a safe condition is to put everything into killing an opponent. I'd argue that's also part of why "Potions as a quick action" is such a common house rule, because otherwise you're never going to use a potion that can be wiped out in a single dice roll

Healing needs an incentive to use outside of "Well, the DM's being a jerk" in the case of double tapping

How much % hp should a healer be able to restore in a single round and at what resource cost?