How bad does the bard suck?

[Geron Raveneye]

I just like to bring up this point from time to time, about how much my favorite class, the bard, sucks in 3e. Please feel free to give your response to this topic below. To answer a few questions/accusations preemptively-

1. I do not hate bards, I love them. That is why I cry because they suck.
2. I do play them right, in fact, I amaze people all the time with how effective I can make a bard in both terms of game mechanics and roleplay.
3. I do not believe bards shine only in roleplay heavy/investigative scenarios. I have proven time and again that if you want to make a Bluff, Gather Information, Diplomacy king you are better off with other classes. BARDS RECEIVE NO BUFFS TO THESE SKILLS OR ABILITIES! Bards should shine in all scenarios and campaigns just like any other class.

Let the hatemongering begin!

Every year the same thing, huh? http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=161198&page=1&pp=40

 

[Arashi Ravenblade]

I said Bards dont suck they, people dont play them right. Though to be honest they are the worst class in the game, but in the right hands could be very good. Too bad in my group the only people who like playing bards are in fact crappy players in the descisions they make.

 

[Fishbone]

Inspirational Boost+Masterwork War Drums+Elation+Song of The Heart+Battle Rattle=The guys playing the 3/4 Base Classes high fiving you a lot.
Melodic Casting and DC bumping magical instruments also means your Suggestions will be rocking the house with DCs approaching the 30s very quickly. They've got tons of good buffing and defensive spells and with things like Sound Burst, Cacaphonic Burst, Fanfare, Wail of Doom, Shout/Greater Shout, they've got plenty of good blasting spells, too in their careers. Seriously, whats the problem here? I'd take a Bard over a Rogue any day, and rogues are regarded by many as one of the most balanced classes in the game.

 

[Nifft]

Player 1: 'Look out! A bunch of orcs are attacking!'
Player 2: 'What should we do?'
Bard: 'I know, I'll sing buff us all.'

Meta-gaming: taking teh suck out of teh bard since 3.0e.

I mean seriously, would you dis the Cleric for saying, "I know, I'll pray (casts bless)"?

Though in the Bard's case, it's a little sad that the mechanics are actually better than the flavor...

Cheers, -- N

 

[Cavebear]

In a historical campaign, the bard class could be used not only for entertainers but also politicians, priests, teachers, historians, military officers, lawyers, rebel/cult leaders--lots of professions could easily be represented by low-level bards, and bards could be quite successful in many professions.

A high level bard can be a good nemesis character for the party, blackening the party's reputation when they are not around, popular and untouchable in public, and capable of influencing the other NPC's to oppose the party. The party may not even immediately realise who is opposing them!

Bards also make good colour characters.

All in all, a useful class for any creative DM.

 

[Darklone]

That reminds me of someone who used bards instead of clerics in his setting. I tried that once and it was not a bad idea.

 

[Geron Raveneye]

Whether Bards suck compared to other classes in abilities, I don't know. I've never liked them as a class and would never play one. I just can't get behind them as a player. The 'magic of song' just never struck me as being all that interesting.

Player 1: 'Look out! A bunch of orcs are attacking!'
Player 2: 'What should we do?'
Bard: 'I know, I'll sing.'

Tastes differ, I suppose...but truly, one only has to read the Lord of the Rings, or the Silmarillion, to get an example of how "silly" song magic truly is, huh?

 

[Klaus]

Meta-gaming: taking teh suck out of teh bard since 3.0e.

I mean seriously, would you dis the Cleric for saying, "I know, I'll pray (casts bless)"?

Though in the Bard's case, it's a little sad that the mechanics are actually better than the flavor...

Cheers, -- N

It's not like anyone's dissing Henry V for using his Perform (oratory) skill to Inspire Greatness in St. Crispin's Day...

"Bardic Music" need not be music.

 

[Lodow MoBo]

Bards are very late in being fun to play in combat. This is one reason why they are a hard class to play. Now on the reverse they are great out of combat, even early on. They are amazing at 9th level and on.

I had one of the most enjoyable games with a bard. I played the bard because it was the weakest class. It was a very enlightening experience.

 

[Cabral]

I just like to bring up this point from time to time, about how much my favorite class, the bard, sucks in 3e. Please feel free to give your response to this topic below. To answer a few questions/accusations preemptively-

Last time I remember you bringing up the topic, you also had a seperate "hatemongering" post discussing how bards suck. IIRC, then, like now, the majority of voters disagreed with you. Are you going to keep renewing the issue until your opponents ignore you and you can get a poll with the answer you want?

1. I do not hate bards, I love them. That is why I cry because they suck.

All I see is someone who bashes bards and exalts their suckage from on high.

2. I do play them right, in fact, I amaze people all the time with how effective I can make a bard in both terms of game mechanics and roleplay.

As Crothian mentioned, you have contradicted yourself.

3. I do not believe bards shine only in roleplay heavy/investigative scenarios. I have proven time and again that if you want to make a Bluff, Gather Information, Diplomacy king you are better off with other classes. BARDS RECEIVE NO BUFFS TO THESE SKILLS OR ABILITIES! Bards should shine in all scenarios and campaigns just like any other class.

You mean like Eagle's Splendor? It adds +2 to any Bluff, Gather Information, and Diplomacy checks. Other complimentory spells include Charm Person/Monster, Comprehend Languages, Disguise Self/Alter Self (Elf attempting Diplomacy with an Orc? No problem), Detect Thoughts, Enthrall, Hold Person (1 round/lvl or less; talk fast, Suggestion, Tongues (Oh, you don't speak the language of the creature you're trying to bluff? No problem.).

Let the hatemongering begin!

The bard is great as he is. He is not a one-character army. He can't mass heal and throw 12 fireballs per day and I hope he never can. Keep your hatemongering to yourself, please.