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How can I avoid a Monty-Haul campaign in DnD?
- Thread starter warfangiscuter
- Start date
I think there's definitely a dysfunctional school of DMing exemplified by James Wyatt's GMing advice column where he detailed his planned 'Greenbriar Chasm' campaign, to be centred on 'Gates of Firestorm Peak' I think it was. And instead of starting his party at the gates of Firestorm Peak, he pushes this ca 6th level 2e adventure up to 4e mid-Paragon and starts his party at 1st level, with around 15 levels to go before they actually 'get to the fun'. Unsurprisingly the campaign he had spent countless months developing then crashed and burned after a few sessions of pointlessness.
It's ok to sketch out a possible 30-year campaign arc that will support years of play (I just did that), but you better make damn sure that the stuff happening next Tuesday is as cool as what you have planned for 2016. If not, then skip to the fun and run that 2016 stuff now.
Balesir
Adventurer
I think this actually hits on a key element of my shifts in RPG preferences over the last few years. I no longer have hours and hours to game, as I did in my youth; I get around 1 weekend per 2-3 months. If the game has a "point", an excellent time to get to it would be now - for all values of now!
Henry
Autoexreginated
Another possibility is to use the "inherent bonuses" idea as detailed in this thread:
http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?276932-Inherent-Enhancement-Bonuses-variant-rule
In short, at certain level breaks, just give the PCs bonuses to AC & defenses, attacks and damage, etc. and make them the same bonus types as magic weapons - you can flavor it however you want (as training and experience, as Ki, etc.) and watch the desire to accumulate every scrap of wealth for a new magic item that just gives bonuses disappear in a puff of smoke.
Then, wealth can be for status, to attain a huge campaign-altering goal, or just for the stereotypical Ale and Whores.
When a magic item does appear, you can give it unique properties, not just a bonus for its own sake. That magic sword doesn't just give a +1, it glows when darkspawn are near, or it turns into a tattoo on your skin that is indistinguishable from a real tattoo, or it turns into a boat (hello, Xiphoid Xebec!), or...
http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?276932-Inherent-Enhancement-Bonuses-variant-rule
In short, at certain level breaks, just give the PCs bonuses to AC & defenses, attacks and damage, etc. and make them the same bonus types as magic weapons - you can flavor it however you want (as training and experience, as Ki, etc.) and watch the desire to accumulate every scrap of wealth for a new magic item that just gives bonuses disappear in a puff of smoke.
Then, wealth can be for status, to attain a huge campaign-altering goal, or just for the stereotypical Ale and Whores. When a magic item does appear, you can give it unique properties, not just a bonus for its own sake. That magic sword doesn't just give a +1, it glows when darkspawn are near, or it turns into a tattoo on your skin that is indistinguishable from a real tattoo, or it turns into a boat (hello, Xiphoid Xebec!), or...
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I have vague memories of that column but don't think I ever followed it throug to this (rather sad) denoument. It seemed to involve a lot more advance prep than is my usual style (I do some prep, but it is more reactive prep for my next session than advance prep for X years time).
My ideal is that every session will have cool, memorable stuff. Sometimes I end up doing a better job of that than other times!
I think it is OK for the fictional stakes to escalate over time (in fact, in a level-based system like D&D that is probably inevitable). But the real-world stakes - the stuff that keeps the players coming back - have to be worth playing for from the beginning. Unsurprisingly, I find that 4e works well for this. But I think it can be done in other systems too - with perhaps classic D&D as a limited exception: 1st level PCs are so very vulnerable that it's harder to run exciting sessions involving them. (At least, I find it harder.)
S
Sunseeker
Guest
Trit One-Ear
Explorer
This is precisely the problem my campaign hit recently. I had sketched out ideas for a story off and on for the better part of a year. Many of these were long reaching plots and adventures. Once we finally started playing, I had a well developed city, cast of characters, and shadowy villain figure. However, a few weeks in, after two session in which I noticed the players felt particularly "eh" about things, I had to reevaluate my style of story telling.
I went back and reread some of Chris Perkins' articles (my standby source for DMing inspiration) and noticed something. Most of his stories and advice, due to the place he recently was in his campaign(s) centered around the big pay off stories, after having played a long successful campaign. My own tendency to focus on the investment for greater plot pay off later, paired with his Epic level advice had turned my sessions into a constant slog towards a never-nearing goal.
Things are now moving faster for my players, and I think I'm starting to win the, back. I still think Chris's articles are amazingly helpful, but you need to be careful, as many above have said, to make each session exciting and fun, not just a build up to later excitement. As someone told me on these boards (really wish I could remember who!) "give the players the exciting stuff now, and come up with more exciting stuff later!"
Trit
Ps. I plan to give my players a good ol' hack and slash adventure or two after months of political intrigue. Who knew some players don't like that stuff?
Yes, I think I read the same post.
Really good advice, and influenced my own GMing. Nowadays I always try to avoid holding any cool stuff back. Much better to throw it all at the players now, and come up with more cool stuff later. A typical campaign I GM runs ca 22-23 fortnightly 3-hour sessions over a year, and one big 4e encounter can take a session, so it's not like I won't have plenty of time to think up more stuff.I do find Perkins' articles one of the best things on DDI. He's smart, thinks well on his feet, and has plenty of self-awareness. He deals with a lot of the issues I see come up, and while his own inclination is a bit more plot-based/linear than I like, he's aware of the potential problems with that and is willing to let go of his plans when the PCs 'ruin' them.
D'karr
Adventurer
And that right there is DM gold. The DM's willingness to follow the story of the characters rather than the overarching metaplot that he has prepared is the most important pacing element of the game. Follow the lead, and if there is no lead then lead them. If a player "breaks" your story, go with it. Adapt and follow their story.
I learned this the hard way a couple of campaigns ago, you cannot ask the players what they do next and then spend 2+ hours waiting for an actual response. You will waste everyone's time. This is when your preparation comes into play. At that point LEAD them.
By the same token when the players are on the move, the best thing to do is get out of the way and "see with them" where it leads. This is where your preparation also pays off - improvisation is 90% preparation couched to look like you just thought that up.
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