How do I make it really "low-magic"?

[Gothmog]

Yep, Joshua has it right- I got the name after the chief of the balrogs in the the Silmarillion. I had forgotten about Dungeon Master, but sure enough your are right, there was a wizard in that game with a black robe and glowing red eyes named Gothmog!

Anyway Raistlin, I didn't really nerf the other classes at all. I didn't want to go into extreme detail in my post, but I redesigned all the magic-using classes based upon traditions of magic in my world (cabalism, mediumship, witchcraft, diabolism, etc). Casters from those traditions can all spontaneously cast spells they know, in addition to memorizing them. Tradeoff is that spontaneous spells take effect at 1d2 levels lower. Also, I modified save DCs for spells so that they are 10 + spell level + 1/2 caster level. In the end, this save modification benefits casters, since by 7-10th level, they have higher bonuses from 1/2 their level than they would from a stat adjustment (I use 4d6, drop lowest, no rerolls).

Thusfar in the game, there have been no problems with balance issues. The fighter types do well in a fight, but the spellcasters truly shine in the problem-solving and non-combat situations. Most of the time, the enemies of the PCs are not expecting magic to be used against them, so when it is, I roleplay their actions accordingly (usually either fear, or more rarely pin-the-tail (or arrow) on-the-spellcaster). Thats not to say that the spellcasters aren't good in a fight either- they use more subtle magics to keep from being targeted, aid other combatants, and use missile weapons. Of course, magic items are much more rare as well- the best item in the group is a minor artifact called the Brazen Head, which has a powerful demon trapped inside it. It can answer almost any kind of query, but in order to do so, 1 pint of sentient being blood must be given to the thing per question. Needless to say, its not used very often!! Other than that, each character is now 8-10th level, has one magical weapon of +2 total or lesser enchantment, some sort of defensive magical item (not necessarily armor or AC booster), and 1-2 misc items of low power (I'd almost be tempted to call them +.5 items).

Hope that answers some of your questions. Let me know if you want to know more.

 

[mistergone]

Thanks again everyone. I've pretty much already came to my own conclusion on how to work it out, after reading everyone's input, of course. I'll give an extremely rough outline, prolly missing a few points, but the basics are:

1.) Certain classes are restricted, especially Wizard, sorcerer, druid, bard, monk, and cleric. Each of these classes will have a couple minor tweaks, but otherwise remain as they are. They will be rare in the game world. If a played happens to be one of these classes, they are very likely one of the only ones around. Oh yeah! No barbarians! The area the game is taking place in is a pretty advanced culture. Barbarians exist in the far far northern reaches, or among the more savage humanoid tribes.

2.) Certain spells just do not exist in the game world. Many spells exist but work differently than typical. Many spells are more subtle than their original versions.

3.) Certain monster types do not exist in the game world. I guess I could have mentioned this before, but I've always not used certain monsters for various reasons, whether they just didn't fit the fell of the world or simply because I didn't like them. Some might exist but come from another source. Particularly magic-heavy monsters, and just really silly ones, won't be around. Some mosnters will just become much more rare.

4.) Only a very few prestige classes will be available. Most likely NPCs will have prestige classes rather than players.

5.) Since blackpowder technology exists, certain small things will have to be tweaked, but mostly those will not involve magic, rather, the presence of guns will make up for combat magic and other magical effects, but not necessarily take the place of them. Some other technology also exists that makes life easier in some ways, instead of magic. Alchemy still allows for certain potions and similar.

Thanks again everyone for your advice. I suppose when I made my rant about "low magic D&D being hard to do" I sahould have clairified it with "Hard to do and not have players balk at the idea". The double-edged sword of D&D is that, while most everyone knows the game, they also expect certain things from it.

 

[LostSoul]

Oh yeah! No barbarians! The area the game is taking place in is a pretty advanced culture. Barbarians exist in the far far northern reaches, or among the more savage humanoid tribes.

You don't have to look at Barbarians as savages. That's the flavour text. Look at their class abilities instead. They're quick, defensive warriors at home in the wilderness who can work themselves into a battle trance. And illiterate. A thug from the inner city who "loses it" when he fights is a good example of a Barbarian. (Change Wilderness Lore to Urban Lore.) Think Joe Pesci from Casino.

The d12 Hit Die doesn't have to mean they are really strong physically; since Hit Points are abstract, your Barbarian could focus on defense more than a Fighter does. Thus Barbarian could be a good class for a light-armoured swashbuckler who uses his improved mobility for good effect.

 

[mistergone]

You don't have to look at Barbarians as savages. That's the flavour text. Look at their class abilities instead. They're quick, defensive warriors at home in the wilderness who can work themselves into a battle trance. And illiterate. A thug from the inner city who "loses it" when he fights is a good example of a Barbarian. (Change Wilderness Lore to Urban Lore.) Think Joe Pesci from Casino.

/B]

Well, I'm considering allowing barbarian as a class for any northerner (from the sort of celtic/highlander culture) but most likely, none of the players will be from that culture, as the focus of the game initially will be the events surrounding a civil war in their home kingdom. Very few outsiders have reason to participate in this war. There's a few dwarves that have lived among Man for a while, and a few elves (though elves are seen as the sort of "native americans"), but for the most part, in this game world, races are not so integrated as say, your average Forgotten Realms game or Greyhawk. There's also very few "halfbreeds" such as half-elves and half-orcs are unheard of.

Players might certainly play one of those races, but will have a backstory and reason to be involved in the conflict. I already have an idea where some dwarves sell firearms to the rebels (even though Man created firearms in the first place), and some small bands of elves might sympathize with the rebels, as the King's men have become increasingly brutal and destructive on the land. The King will conscript bandits and hobgoblins to help suppress the rebel forces. Hm, I should post a basic outline of the campaign.

 

[Desdichado]

Interesting... my own thoughts on campaign settings are very close to this same idea (low magic, blackpowder weapons, etc.) but my implementation is completely different.

It's interesting to me how d20 is so maleable. My own homebrew has practically nothing mechanics-wise that I made up, either, it's almost all in print somewhere.

 

[mistergone]

Interesting... my own thoughts on campaign settings are very close to this same idea (low magic, blackpowder weapons, etc.) but my implementation is completely different.

It's interesting to me how d20 is so maleable. My own homebrew has practically nothing mechanics-wise that I made up, either, it's almost all in print somewhere.

I plan on making up very few mechanics. The fewer the better.

 

[LGodamus]

Hve your spellcasters take the expert class and use the COCD20 spell casting system...

 

[mistergone]

I think I've figured out all the main points. Soon I'm gonna go through the core boks and see what I won't have in the game. I'm not keen on buying any other books (save maybe Swashbuckling Adventures) as I'm poor, for one, and I just don't want to get a whole book for one small part of it. I had COC D20, and took it back the next day, just didn't like it, not my style at all. If I wanted hopeless horror, well, I already have real life.

Anyways, thanks everyone, and I certainly hope I passed the audition... er... no wait.. uh... yeah. Thanks!


P.S. I'm going today to my local store and burning up this month's 25% off coupon on Swashbuckling Adventures.

 

[Frostmarrow]

Picking up Swashbuckling is a good idea in my opinion. I don't think the players would balk at the idea of playing Swashbuckling. One of the great thhings about it is that it still supports vikings and knights. Not just musketeers and pirates.

As an example. A magic sword in Swashbuckling has a +1 bonus to to hit (not damage). The sword might also have other abilities such as becoming coated with poison on the push of a button but... And this is the great part... the sword will become unbalanced and the +1 bonus will be lost until the sword's poison container is refilled!

In order to balance the characters (since they will have little magic) the prestige classes rock. The abilities you can get from those would break any game which has magic as well. For example there are feats that will increase your base AC with from +3 to +10 or more. I'd hate to see that AND bracers of armor.

 

[LostSoul]

Thinking out loud...

Barbarians would make a great swashbuckling class if you tweak them just a little bit. They have the high hit points, which represent masterful parrying, etc. They have light armour, fast movement, and uncanny dodge.

Switch a few class skills around - give them Perform and Bluff (and maybe Sense Motive) and take away Listen, Wilderness Lore, and Swim; and change Rage into "Swashbucking Flair" that increases Dex instead of Str.

Your high Hit Points represent your parrying skill; the Con increase that you get while in your Flair means that blows that otherwise would have knocked you down are now just "flesh wounds".

That sounds like a great class, actually. I think I'll cross-post on the House Rules forum.