How important is multi-classing, and why?

[Celebrim]

I don't see how it could be accomplished using a rigid class system, but man do I love Skyrim where my greataxe-wielding orc in heavy dragonplate has two signature spells that he's practiced for specific situations.

I'll note that Skyrim is a solo game. I think the problem is less rigid class than it is in a cooperative game you'd be breaking the fundamental law of role-playing: "Thou shalt not be good at everything."

It's well known you can do point buy on a single player cRPG. I'll be more impressed if someone manages to make it work really well in a Diablo style 'real time table top' game or a WoW style MMORPG.

Feats or themes could work to emulate that, as could a mechanism where one could swap class features.

I think it would be hard in a Vancian system to produce a Skyrim like result. I'm not ready to abandon the Vancian spellcasting system for that cause, but you probably could do something like a fighter that can use 1 3rd and 1 4th level spell (at suitably high level) view a feat/perk system of some sort.

As far as a mechanism for swapping class features, I think you'd be better off implementing some sort of generalist class as the framework for that. An base example would be Monte's Aesthetic class from Arcana Evolved, but you could probably take the idea much farther if you borrowed some of 4e's systemization and applied it to a more 3e style approach.

 

[Aldarc]

To be clear: I am not advocating a point buy system for character creation. Quite the opposite, in fact. I want classes to have value and integrity in themselves and not simply be "toolkit packages" players dip into as far as they get a particular ability. If the player is just multiclassing for the particular abilities, then I would rather just provide them with some other way to take it. IMHO, a generic class system like True20's (adept, expert, warrior) is far more suitable for mutliclassing for particular abilities than D&D, where the archetypes seem more well-defined.

As far as a mechanism for swapping class features, I think you'd be better off implementing some sort of generalist class as the framework for that. An base example would be Monte's Aesthetic class from Arcana Evolved, but you could probably take the idea much farther if you borrowed some of 4e's systemization and applied it to a more 3e style approach.

Do you mean Akashic?

 

[Ulrick]

Just make the game simpler for everybody and get rid of multiclassing.

1. Keeping track of the math and the stats is a pain.
2. Multiclassed characters sacrifce so much that they simply aren't as equal to their single-classed peers (especially at high levels).
3. And as the horse said to the goose: "Although I'm confined to one element, I'd rather be a master there instead of a goose in three."

 

[Celebrim]

Do you mean Akashic?

Yeah, that's the one.

 

[HardcoreDandDGirl]

I want to see all multi classing and dual classing allowed. I want to see feat like swaps for dabbling in a class, and Hybrid like (or 2e style) for more full bore multi classing, and I want to see a way to do what 2e did, and 3e did I stop being a fighter and take 5 levels of wizard.

If this system is truly all inclusive they I should be able to be a Fighter 5 with wizard multi class feats, a Fighter/Wizard hybrid level 5, a 3rd level fighter/ 2nd level wizard, or a swordmage level 5, or a dusk blade level 5.

And yes I would love to have my cake and eat it too.

 

[Nivenus]

Just make the game simpler for everybody and get rid of multiclassing.

1. Keeping track of the math and the stats is a pain.
2. Multiclassed characters sacrifce so much that they simply aren't as equal to their single-classed peers (especially at high levels).
3. And as the horse said to the goose: "Although I'm confined to one element, I'd rather be a master there instead of a goose in three."

1. So use 4e-style classes where character progression is much, much simpler and you don't have to worry about several different charts determining your character's capacity.
   
   Better yet, why not allow multiclassed characters to level up skills or powers from either of the classes they're training in rather than go back and forth every level. Allow players to choose what class features they'd like to improve and what not.
   
2. This is true in 4e but hardly in 3e, where multiclassed characters could be seriously overpowered due to the fact that they effectively acquired most of the benefits of a class at 1st level.
   
3. "Jack of all trades, master of none, still better than master of one."

I think multiclassing should be supported but shouldn't encourage min/maxing the way it did in 3e. In theory, multiclassing could be added as an optional rule outside of the core rules, giving designers more time to work out the kinks.

Of course, hybrid classes, which already work extraordinarily well in 4e and cover some of the territory of multiclass characters, should be in the core rules right off the bat.